Koreans on both sides of the DMZ have more in common than they do differences. Unfortunately the comprador regime in the south and their handlers in Washington can’t have anyone noticing that.
Unfortunately the current situation appeases the global powers the most. China and Russia will not stand to have a US allied united Korea so close to Beijing and Vladivostok, which means a united Korea is a neutral, non US aligned Korea, which the US does not want. Having North Korea be a buffer state between China/Russia and the US aligned South Korea is the most stable option, and as a result North Korea knows that it can do whatever it wants and still be propped up by Beijing, just as it has since the Korean war
On the other hand, given how over extended US finds itself now with its proxy war in Ukraine, the vassal regime in the south could find support lacking going forward. Given the hellish conditions people experience under this regime, it’s entirely possible that it could fall in not too distant future allowing for reunification.
“If you have enough money, South Korea is a great place to live. But if you don’t . . .” she trails off.
Just work harder some people will say.
Quoting George Carlin
"Forget the politicians. The politicians are put there to give you the idea that you have freedom of choice . . . you don’t. You have no choice. You have owners. They own you. They own everything. They own all the important land. They own, and control the corporations. They’ve long since bought, and paid for the Senate, the Congress, the state houses, the city halls, they got the judges in their back pockets and they own all the big media companies, so they control just about all of the news and information you get to hear. They got you by the balls. They spend billions of dollars every year lobbying . . . lobbying, to get what they want . . . Well, we know what they want. They want more for themselves and less for everybody else, but I’ll tell you what they don’t want . . . they don’t want a population of citizens capable of critical thinking. They don’t want well informed, well educated people capable of critical thinking. They’re not interested in that . . . that doesn’t help them. That’s against their interests. That’s right. They don’t want people who are smart enough to sit around a kitchen table and think about how badly they’re getting fucked by a system that threw them overboard 30 fuckin’ years ago. They don’t want that. You know what they want? They want obedient workers . . . Obedient workers, people who are just smart enough to run the machines and do the paperwork. And just dumb enough to passively accept all these increasingly shittier jobs with the lower pay, the longer hours, the reduced benefits, the end of overtime and vanishing pension that disappears the minute you go to collect it, and now they’re coming for your Social Security money. They want your fuckin’ retirement money. They want it back so they can give it to their criminal friends on Wall Street, and you know something? They’ll get it . . . they’ll get it all from you sooner or later cause they own this fuckin’ place. It’s a big club and you ain’t in it. You and I are not in The big club. By the way, it’s the same big club they use to beat you over the head with all day long when they tell you what to believe. All day long beating you over the head with their media telling you what to believe, what to think and what to buy. The table has tilted folks. The game is rigged and nobody seems to notice. Nobody seems to care. Good honest hard-working people . . . white collar, blue collar it doesn’t matter what color shirt you have on. Good honest hard-working people continue, these are people of modest means . . . continue to elect these rich removed who don’t give a fuck about you. They don’t give a fuck about you . . . they don’t give a fuck about you. They don’t care about you at all . . . at all . . . at all, and nobody seems to notice. Nobody seems to care. That’s what the owners count on. The fact that Americans will probably remain willfully ignorant of the big red, white and blue dick that’s being jammed up their assholes everyday, because the owners of this country know the truth. It’s called the American Dream cause you have to be asleep to believe it . . .”
The Korean director Bong Joon Ho, when asked about why Parasite had resonated so deeply, with so many across the world, replied “there is no borderline between countries now because we all live in the same country, it’s called capitalism.” Parasite is a film that speaks to the class inequalities, societal structures, and violence that underpins capitalism. The same is felt by many, across our world. Capitalism is, in short, a global moral, political, and ecological global disaster. One that is shared across borders and nations.
The South’s current government is ridiculously conservative. Rolling back labour laws and women’s rights were pillars of their election run. They’ll do whatever the US tells them to. It shouldn’t come as a surprise that peaceful diplomacy is not at the forefront of their mind.
It’s honestly pretty cyclical, they bounce back and forth between more diplomatic minded leadership and more warhungry. They are much more in the antagonistic phase of their cycle right now.
There’s no point in negotiating with a dictator whose primary goal is to remain in power. A peaceful end to the conflict means the death of Kim at the hands of the oppressed.
This is like asking a kidnapper to kindly release the hostages or we will ask again later.
Glad you’re not in charge. Currently, there is tension between Korean allies which unfortunately means there will be no peace for the Korean people.
I think with time, Korea can be peacefully reunified. It may not be in my lifetime, but one day I believe it will happen. As time move forward, new events and opportunites arise that may present the chance for reunification.
The problem with North Korea is that its entire cultural identity is built on resisting American aggression. Without having an enemy to fight, what is the reason for the country going on? Why would the people of North Korea tolerate the current government other than to resist invasion?
The North Korean regime needs conflict. It doesn’t need war, but it needs conflict. Kim could have gotten a sweetheart deal from Trump to end the war and never took it. Why? Because getting rid of the “American threat” also gets rid of North Korea’s legitimacy.
Why would the people of North Korea tolerate the current government other than to resist invasion?
The Kim family has done a lot for the people in the DPRK, and is generally very well liked. It’s not all sunshine and rainbows, but a lot of the problems stem not from the current DPRK leadership but the international (read: US) sanctions placed on them. Compared to the hypercapitalist hellscape of SK, the work-life balance in the DPRK seems downright utopian. Prior to the US invasion, the Korean peninsula was fairly unified in their support of socialism.
The people would certainly welcome peace, I just don’t know how that is possible while the threat of the USA looms. People like to portray them as an aggressive country, but they have never done anything to another coountry except threaten to defend themselves.
Is it well liked? Or is it only well liked because the country is doing “the best that it can” against the USA? And even then, is it actually well liked or only liked enough to keep the BoAn from paying too much attention to them?
And I didn’t mention the people of North Korea, I mentioned its government. The North Korean government needs conflict with the USA to justify itself.
Obviously anecdotal, but from the people I spoke to in the DPRK, generally very well liked. And no, I did not have government minders making sure they said “the right thing”. Several programs were quite popular, particularly housing programs. There was a big push for community-based activities during my stay, even smaller towns had community centers where people could go after work to learn new skills or continuing education. The university I was based out of was pretty international as well, but even there people didn’t spend that much time thinking about the US, nor did they have a particularly negative view of the average American citizen. More curious than hostile.
I was there in for several months in graduate school doing research for my thesis, wasn’t part of a tour. Based out of Kim Il Sung university at the time. I spent about a year in South Korea as well prior. Since I wasn’t on a formal tour, I was left to my own devices a lot of the time unless I needed a guide to help me get access somewhere.
Technically yes, every rural farming village could have been secretly micced with hidden cameras on the off chance that a foreigner was going to stop by, but that seems unlikely. This was a little over ten years ago so cell phones (which would be a fairly common metric of government surviellence) were not as prevalent in the DPRK yet as they are now, so a lot of people weren’t carrying one. I was a no-name graduate student, not a well-known diplomat, I don’t think the government was particularly invested in spending large sums of money tracking me. So yes, technically they COULD have, but just as much as any other state could have.
10 years ago is right around when Kim Jong Un came to power and there were a few years of trying to open up before the country closed itself off again. The program you were in may still be going on, but I would be surprised if it did at the level it was when you were there.
But even then, I would be surprised if you weren’t being tracked somehow just to make sure that you weren’t a spy or initiating some local political troubles. You might not have seen it, but it would have been there, and the government would have likely attempted to keep the tracking hidden from you as a way to show its openness.
And I’m not going to be able to argue against your first hand account of rural North Korea. I don’t see the people of North Korea being this group of bloodthirsty Communists who want to blow up all of capitalism. However, I don’t see the people of North Korea being able to put political pressure on their government to change policies. Part of that is that the government of North Korea can use its conflict with the US as a reason to say that they are still at war and therefore can’t allow more to be involved in the political process.
And I’m not going to be able to argue against your first hand account of rural North Korea.
Unless you are from the US or SK, when things open up a bit more that is looking to be possible again. I would encourage you to try visiting if you have the time and means. Even if we totally divorce things from the politics, there’s a lot of beautiful nature there.
Anecdotally, you seem relatively reasonable and I think it would be an interesting experience.
However, I don’t see the people of North Korea being able to put political pressure on their government to change policies.
It does depend to what extent, people can definitely enact policy change. While all political organizations do ultimately belong to the Democratic Front for the Reunification of Korea, they have multiple political parties under that umbrella that do different on some issues. Obviously they aren’t going to suddenly pass laws making the place capitalist, but they can do and do change some things. The Social Democratic Policy is notably more liberal in their attitudes as it was formed by a lot of the petite bourgeoise. They actually have published journal articles that are critical of the ruling party.
I’m sure North Korea is beautiful with its mountain vistas.
But when it comes to the government, the government is on its third generation hereditary ruler. That is a major outlier for Communist countries and a major outlier for republics in general. That isn’t generally a good sign for a government to show that it can change. There might be a balancing of factions that the Supreme Leader has to deal with, but it generally leads to governments that don’t change policy significantly except during transfers of power.
And, a lasting peace with South Korea involving the demilitarization of their mutual border would be that kind of change I don’t see the current government being able to implement.
This isn’t a discussion regarding the morality of the North Korean people or a dissection of Juche philosophy, but an analysis of how the government is set up.
I live in the USA and when I leave my house I am being constantly tracked by at least five different private surveillance networks. There’s hundreds (thousands?) of privately owned facial recognition and license plate scanners within 20 miles of my house. My neighbors even invite them into their homes and have constantly recording cameras facing the street. They are recording everything that goes on everywhere, reporting back to their corporate overlords, and selling that data to whomever can pay (including the US government).
I’d much rather have state surveillance because that’s at least somewhat auditable, and the state is getting the data either way. When municipalities and citizens start paying for the privilege to feed them data is when I start to get really worried about what they’re doing with it.
So don’t fucking cry to me about constant surveillance in north korea. Our lives are constantly being quantified and logged right here in the country that touts itself as the bastion of freedom but continually wipes its ass with the bill of rights.
I’m not crying about it, but I’m noting it is there. I’m also noting that the issue of not toeing the party line may have more consequences for the average person compared to the US.
I’m not crying about it, but I’m noting it is there.
Why? I just explained how terrible surveillance is in the USA in response to you claiming the other poster was constantly being watched while they were in NK after they stated they didn’t have anyone watching over their shoulders every minute. There was no reason to bring that up other than to inflame existing western opinions on the DPRK.
I’m also noting that the issue of not toeing the party line may have more consequences for the average person compared to the US.
It doesnt matter what your political opinions are in the US. Everyone is regarded as if they are an enemy of the state and the rights they pretend to hold so dear are just a suggestion to the people in power. Why else would they have extended the laws they say are created to ‘fight terrorism’ to monitor all citizens at all times? We’re living these consequences every day.
It came in the discussion between the person who went to North Korea and myself regarding their experience. I thought we had a respectful discussion about the experience.
You also talked past my comment about the impacts of the impacts of North Korean surveillance compared to American surveillance. Is the issue that North Korea can’t afford an American like system or a Chinese like system?
The problem with North Korea is that its entire cultural identity is built on resisting American aggression
I am curious: Why do you feel you can confidently speak on the exact nature of another nations cultural identity? Let alone reduce it in this way?
Not sure if you understand how arrogant your statement is, but you have to realize that you have 0 idea of the cultural identity of the people in the DPRK.
Corporate news isn’t interested in showing you anything but the conflict don’t make the mistake of letting that shape your perception. The first step is realizing your ignorance
Bc I haven’t heard of the cultural identity of a government
And its still not true, they have a distinct political ideology that used to be called juche, idk if they changed the name.
Also you said: “the problem with North Korea is…” not really an indicator you’re talking about the government, especially given the context of a cultural identity
Two Kims have already died and nothing changed. The current one is Swiss educated, likes NBA, and speaks at least a little English. If there was a hope that a change of dictator was going to do anything, he was it.
Don’t even know why that was even an option, anyway. NK isn’t ever going to cooperate with its “enemies” and will just continue to indoctrinate its population with propaganda.
The only solution is a military invasion of NK. Always has been.
Well yes, you are definitely exaggerating if you are suggesting that half the planet is a ‘death cult’. Maybe if you want to say that the foreign policy establishment in certain countries is, then it would be a more reasonable statement.
I don’t think that “the West” is even a useful term.
Lol, news flash. Western white people are not half the planet. Never have been. They are a significant minority.
You don’t get to decide if the West is a useful term. You have to listen to the global majority on that. And they demonstrate it’s utility by using it.
The foreign policy establishment is tiny. There are millions of people screaming at their TVs, lynching black people, shooting protestors, buying guns, watching and producing military propaganda movies, watching and producing TV shows about hero white people killing Asiatic hordes, celebrating the European genocide against indigenous people, calling water protectors terrorists, baying for the blood of Iranians, Russians, Chinese… Millions who thinks dropping nukes on population centers was the best course of action. That vacation in Vietnam and marvel at how backwards they are and don’t think Kissinger is that bad.
It’s not like you and your family and friends and countrymen are just normal people who weren’t raised for 20 years on genocidal indoctrination by your parents, grandparents, teachers, books, TVs, movies, politicians, historians, memorials, and religions. You just don’t think you were.
It’s not the foreign policy establishment. It’s the entire European project for the last 600 years. You don’t get out of it by just saying “it’s only the power elite”. If the US had a popular revolt, I guarantee you that it would result in major mass killings of the marginalized, because despite your fantasy, the majority of Americans are part of the death cult.
I love weird infographic maps. Wonder why the areas have been chosen to be portrayed that way. There’s more border control between EU and USA than EU and LATAM.
Western world is a weird concept anyway. All the different blues in wikipedia’s map are closer to a global community and a common culture than the map above.
Even Africa and India are more connected to the rest of the world, maybe only some of those Asian countries, heavily authoritarian either by religion or just totalitarianism, are the exception
I mean Japan is typically included as part of The West, and it is to the east of China. Cuba is in the western hemisphere, but it is Marxist-Leninist. I don’t think directional terms of the globe make as much sense in the 21st century as they did in the premodern world.
The term “The West” is not to mean something geographical but rather countries that value the Western culture. That’s why the US, Australia, New Zealand and even more notably Israel, Japan and South Korea are fitted into that category. Even though none of these countries are European they all follow along with western traditions or have been westernised in some way or another. If you look at maps of policy decision taking and such (there is even a community dedicated for this in Reddit and I think also here called /alwaysthesamemap) you will see how most of the time “The International Community” is the set of Europe plus the aforementioned countries.
That is also why the term “Global South” doesn’t really need to be taken literally since for example colonised States such as Hawai’i, or imperialized countries such as Mexico or certain parts of northern Africa are technically above the equator. It is more a symbolic allegorical representation of the people on top (the ruling classes) and the ones below (the oppressed masses).
No, I’m under the belief that there are groups of bad people that the rest of us need protection from.
I’m also under the belief that I live in a democracy, in which we the people choose our leaders. If the government does something bad, it’s because we put someone bad into power. The blame lies with us, not some distant, faceless, unelected hierarchy.
Don’t believe me? Listen to Republican rhetoric some time. Decode the dog whistles. You’ll find that they’ve been doing precisely what they’ve been saying they’d do: ban abortion, make life hell for immigrants, give money to the rich, dismantle democracy, and so on. None of their actions are surprising. There is no deep state conspiracy here, just politicians doing what they were elected to do.
First of all, protection from bad groups is very important. But I don’t believe it should be provided to us by people that would do anything to harm you as long as it’s profitable and they can get away with it (that’s also inherently a bad group)
If you were under a democracy basic human rights like the freedom of movement, housing, healthcare and autonomy of one’s body would never be QUESTIONED. Even assuming you democratically elected the republican party so they could do that (the americans elected the democrats in 2020, in case you’ve forgotten) it’s inherently undemocratic to take away your human rights, even if it was voted on.
If you were under a democracy the policies that the government approves wouldn’t be the ones lobbied by the rich. That’s what we call “corruption”
Also, it’s funny you mention abortion, considering it was the supreme court that overturned Roe v Wade. I’m not sure about you but the supreme court doesn’t look like the most democratic institution to me.
First of all, protection from bad groups is very important. But I don’t believe it should be provided to us by people that would do anything to harm you as long as it’s profitable and they can get away with it (that’s also inherently a bad group)
Then who will protect us? Who, but the government, can hope to have more manpower and firepower than organized crime?
If you were under a democracy basic human rights like the freedom of movement, housing, healthcare and autonomy of one’s body would never be QUESTIONED. Even assuming you democratically elected the republican party so they could do that (the americans elected the democrats in 2020, in case you’ve forgotten) it’s inherently undemocratic to take away your human rights, even if it was voted on.
That’s a bit of a paradox of democracy, isn’t it? Does democracy give the people the power to vote away their power to vote? You would say no, but then does that not imply there is some greater power than the will of the people? For there to be a greater power than the will of the people doesn’t sound very democratic.
If you were under a democracy the policies that the government approves wouldn’t be the ones lobbied by the rich. That’s what we call “corruption”
You forget, they do so with the tacit approval of the voters who keep voting for them after they do so. Members of Congress who sell America out to the highest bidder often do so for decades, not just one term.
Also, it’s funny you mention abortion, considering it was the supreme court that overturned Roe v Wade. I’m not sure about you but the supreme court doesn’t look like the most democratic institution to me.
It is also the Supreme Court that instituted the right to abortion in the first place. Roe v. Wade is the name of a Supreme Court case.
Congress should have codified the right to an abortion, and would have if not for people electing enough Republicans and DINOs to block such a bill.
In the USA (and most places, honestly) all your options are lobbied by rich, there is no alternative in your great democracy. It’s rich people that hate gays, women, immigrants and workers or rich people that hate workers. I wouldn’t call that democracy, personally. And I also don’t think that those people lobbied by the rich, people that couldn’t give less of a crap about us, should be the ones in charge of protecting us. There are more people in the world than monsters, there is more love in the world than hate. Humanity loves the earth and everyone on it, we have the power to create a society based on love and respect we have for eachother. A better world is possible, don’t let these inhumane beings let you believe otherwise.
As you said, you could call my definiton of democracy a paradox, that is a valid argument. But I’d like to say that’s slightly more democratic than having rich people run around and do whatever they want with the fruits of OUR labour, destroying the planet for fun and the endless accumulation of fake tokens to the point where a human can not even comprehend that big of a number, and then blaming US for the state the planet is in.
Society has existed before the state and will exist after the state.
Anarkiddies have and are fighting on the frontlines. Only issue is, it’s hard to remain anarchist when the people you’ve allied with are trying to execute you (26 July movement, for example)
There are examples of anarchists fighting by themselves, most notably the Free Territory of Ukraine (for the most part, though it did fight alongside the red army on multiple occasions) there’s also the AANES which isn’t inherently anarchist but does have a lot of it’s libertarian characteristics, there’s the zapatistas which you could argue that they are anarchists and I’d say they’re definitely fighting alone, and of course Revolutionary Catalonia, which created a (functional?) society while still facing the much stronger fascists to the west and a lot of internal repercussion from republicans/marxists.
This is also ignoring the fact that most anarchists would rather fight for a lesser evil when possible instead of sitting around doing nothing.
The only solution is a military invasion of NK. Always has been.
The US always could have not disrupted the planned elections and installed a military dictatorship that kept a lot of the Japanese colonial officers around and started mass killing Koreans. Then the democratic korea wouldn’t have had to try to liberate their country.
Could’ve, would’ve, should’ve. The US has had a long and sordid history of downright fucked-up foreign policy decisions.
But, bitching about it doesn’t really change the current situation. NK has a dictatorship with a enough military power that it still requires a decent army to overrun. Kim isn’t going to listen to any diplomacy, except when he can trick some diplomat to give him more power or image-building. At best, China might be able to cut off its funding and topple Kim’s little empire, but China has no interest in that.
I would argue that we are, as a planetary civilization, almost past the point where a war of that sort is even possible.
On the other hand, if China were to ever shun NK, I would bet that their government would likely collapse in less than a decade.
Sadly, China has a ton of reasons to want to prevent that, one of the bigger ones being the border with NK where many, many refugees would try to cross into China.
I could however see, someday, China agreeing to a massive backroom deal on a scale that would be unprecedented:
China abruptly works to ensure a complete collapse of the NK government, without any NK nuclear weapons either coming into play or any NK nuclear weapons going missing (except to China itself, if it wants them).
And SK along with a good chunk of the Western world agrees to immediately conduct one of the largest humanitarian missions in history, to ensure that nobody is fleeing NK into China unless they have tons of assets and they want to avoid repercussions for their actions.
There are, sadly, a lot of reasons why China wouldn't want the western powers capable of pulling that off to have control of territory that close to China though.
SK would be their safest bet, but SK doesn't have the resources to pull of that kind of a humanitarian effort.
And the chances that someone like the US wouldn't take the chance to plop a military base in what is currently NK seems awfully slim.
will just continue to indoctrinate its population with propaganda.
Oh yes, definitely that doesn’t happen in any of those “civilized” western countries right? Nobody making up things like “North Koreans have no word for love” or “We push trains to work every day”.
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