It gives me hope for the future of beehaw refederating with that instance. They host some interesting communities. To be clear, I fully support beehaw defederating, it's just heartwarming to see instance admins do things that move things forward
This was the right call. I’d never been there before and just checked out the announcement post and it’s full of hatred, insults and bile towards this decision. Their users are calling this a “far left instance that hates free speech run by politically correct pussies”. What a nasty community.
I have a noob question. From a technical point of view, why does it matter to server A (beehaw) whether server B (world) federates with C (exploding nazis) or not? Since A is defederated from C, the content should be unavailable anyway. I completely get why a proper moderation of B itself is crucial, but what B federates with should be irrelevant if B itself stays "pure", right? Again, from a technical point of view, because otherwise willingly federating with nazis obviously strongly correlates with allowing nazis inside. To reiterate, how is A directly affected by what B federates with? Is it merely a matter of lobbying or is there some technicality I'm missing here?
From a technical standpint, it doesn't matter. The point is more just that it's an indicator of moderation style and what we can hope to see in the future.
I think it's more just the stance beehaw has in general. They don't want to federate with the Nazi instance, or anyone that wants to do with them. Same way people don't want to hang out with racists, or people who also hang out with racists.
Tolerance is not a moral absolute; it is a peace treaty. Tolerance is a social norm because it allows different people to live side-by-side without being at each other’s throats. It means that we accept that people may be different from us, in their customs, in their behavior, in their dress, in their sex lives, and that if this doesn’t directly affect our lives, it is none of our business. But the model of a peace treaty differs from the model of a moral precept in one simple way: the protection of a peace treaty only extends to those willing to abide by its terms. It is an agreement to live in peace, not an agreement to be peaceful no matter the conduct of others. A peace treaty is not a suicide pact.
Yes, a comparison of how they answered to the same question: "Are you actively moderating against racism, sexism, homophobia and transphobia?"
Antik is admin of lemmy.world.
TheDude is network enthusiast and owner of sh.itjust.works. AvianCarrier is mod of https://sh.itjust.works/c/networking. AvianCarrier is aggressive. The team disturbingly influenzes the decision making during their voting processes.
It does seem like .world is trying to corral itself and curb the issues that flared up from their growth, so that's very promising. Meanwhile, shit just works is still an absolute dumpster fire.
Actually, sh.itjust.works removed their c/thedonald community so they seem to be taking steps in the right direction too. Still probably not time to refederate until more granular mod tools are developed but it's a promising sign.
Edit: Apparently they haven't defederated from exploding heads yet, so that is a thing still. Come on sh.itjust.works, just do the thing. Make your instance better for it.
There's been a vote up in their agora community for over a week now about defederating from the nazi instance. Administrators have done nothing. Not a good look in my opinion
After this and hopefully more positive decisions, and Lemmy itself getting better mod tools in time, hopefully we'll refederate with them. But as other comments from this thread show, the other one might be a lost case.
sh.itjust.works also killed their c/thedonald community. Both of those instances are doing pretty good self moderating and preventing hate. Still dont need to refederate until the tool set gets better but I have accounts on both now and read them as much or more than beehaw.
Well, they still federate with exploding-heads.. I don't know if I'd say they're doing good at preventing hate, it kinda feels like there was just a lot of pressure to kill c/thedonald.
It's still a step in the right direction at least, but yeah, if they don't defederate from that instance it kind of says a lot about their attitudes. I was trying to be optimistic that them removing that community might signal that they're going to defederate from that instance next.
The latest comments I saw from the admin was that they would defederate from instances with hate speech and bigotry (https://sh.itjust.works/comment/476848) but yet there's been no action so while I want to be optimistic, it's a bit hard. Their community already had a discussion about it and it seemed positive that they should defed but no action (https://sh.itjust.works/post/151703).
I hope so too, but at least there's always Beehaw 🐝🤠
Honestly I'd rather refederate with .world before them anyway, at least .world seems to be trying to keep on top of this stuff despite their massive user growth. Looking forward to updated versions of Lemmy where that more granular moderation control is available.
My suspicion -- and this is coming out of my behind -- is that rather than being proactive about these things, they're setting themselves up to learn a hard lesson about known troll tactics. They're trying to be all free-speechy and user-decisiony, but spaces like TD just draw people who will not ever actually follow the server rules.
So, they'll keep dancing over this line, giving these communities the benefit of the doubt, only to discover time and again that they don't care about their rules, and they'll have to be banned.
End of the day, I think TheDude is being a naive idealist. A lot of us can see from 20,000 feet where this will lead, and can't help but be frustrated by this approach. I've seen people assuming the lack of action is a backdoor endorsement, and that TheDude is more than happy to have his instance raided by the nazi instance. I'm uncertain whether I believe that, and heavily lean towards that I do not, instead thinking he's running the 5th fastest growing instance while also falling for the Alt-Right's playbook. He may not want his instance to be a favorite place for nazi sympathizers to hang out, but if he keeps at this, he will foster an environment where it will be a favorite place for nazi sympathizers to hang out
Also, I'm dreadcited for this new season. I'm dreading disappointment. I'm excited that maybe with 10 years of ideas in the tank, the writers will actually have put something wonderful together
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