The Beehaw project is entering some significant challenges

There is a lot of discussion happening in the background of our project here. We could not anticipate all of the challenges that we were going to face a few years ago. One of the reasons for this was because we had no idea what our choice of a platform would bring.

Specifically, we chose Lemmy as the software that we would use to launch our endeavor to attempt a safe space for marginalized persons online.

In the first year or so, this choice was completely successful for a very small number of users. And then we all experienced an enormous influx of users when Reddit announced/implemented their shutting down of third party apps.

Since then there has been a huge number of people that have joined the Beehaw project. This tsunami of users initiated technical problems, and otherwise, that we could not foresee.

Thankfully and fortunately, we have had a couple of incredibly knowledgeable persons that have swooped in to ’save the day’ and keep this site running.

Unfortunately, these persons will NOT be able to continue to support the Beehaw project much further. They have life commitments and other factors, including careers and family life, that will prevent them from contributing to our project in an ongoing fashion.

All that being said, Lemmy (the software that Beehaw runs on) development is incredibly slow and is riddled with problems that makes administration/moderation very painful.

Therefore, we are left with some options that may feel uncomfortable to us. For example, we may want to consider leaving the Fediverse for another software platform that does NOT include ActivityPub. To explain, Fediverse/ActivityPub are very positive concepts on the foundational level. However, the Beehaw project is struggling to include this because most of our moderation/content/ethos is being jeopardized from OTHER federated instances (i.e. it, mostly, is NOT coming from within our own Beehaw registered user base).

The aforementioned persons, that have ’swooped in to save the day’, have been discussing/working with us to come up with the best solutions that would enable the Beehaw project to continue while NOT needing incredibly experienced/technically adept persons around.

Right now, we are testing alternative software platforms and evaluating them based on everything that we want Beehaw to become in the future.

Thank you all for your continued support of the Beehaw project and entrusting us to make this happen.

mvrkws,

Losing Beehaw would definitely hurt Lemmy. This was not my first home on Lemmy, but I quickly saw that all of the good communities seemed to belong to this place.

However, I would probably never have found this place if you weren’t federated. I would naively assume others are in the same boat as me.

I did initially come to Lemmy only as an alternative to reddit, but I’ve stayed because of the ActivityPub protocol. I’d probably not stay active on Beehaw on another protocol, and I’d definitely still keep a Lemmy account on another instance.

I do understand your concerns, and what you wish to achieve. Personally I would have just hoped you tried to achieve it here for longer. Though I do get the struggles with moderation.

Whatever you decide I wish the best for this community in the long term! I hope that regardless of it staying here, or moving elsewhere, it thrives and keeps the content and discussions that its members would like to have.

Bitrot,
@Bitrot@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

Makes sense. Beehaw was always its own community first, federation seemed to be some extra stuff on top of that. Staying on lemmy with less federation or even a few forum software makes sense for the goals of the project.

You’d lose the people who wanted different, but I don’t think being a major social hub for everybody was ever the intent.

GunnarRunnar,

Honestly, I wholeheartedly support this move. For a couple of (obviously subjective) reasons:

  • Lemmy/kbin isn't ready. If Beehaw staff were able to fork their own version of the base code with their moderation etc. design preferences in mind, this would be another thing -- though even then it might not be enough to be worth it with the headache of fediverse moderation.
  • Closed system/community is more personal, hence more productive and less noisy. At least before it outgrows itself.

What I'd hope but is also more work and potentially creates conflicts, is that the new platform provides good moderation logging etc. Which I think is key feature to ensure trust and self policing.

keet,
@keet@kbin.social avatar

As a kbin.social user, we would all be diminished if Beehaw were to defederate. If I were to ever move instances from a kbin to a lemmy platform, it would be over to you guys. I hope that you guys are able to find the help you need to keep going as part of the wider fediverse.

furrowsofar,

Thanks for the heads up. Short answer for me is that I joined for a civil place on the Threadiverse not a walled garden. So if you guys leave the Threadiverse I will have to find a new home.

So I think you all will need to decide where to take this community. I will understand whatever you all decide. Just please communicate it clearly when the time comes.

Thanks for all of the hard work you all have done and are doing.

lemillionsocks,
@lemillionsocks@beehaw.org avatar

I feel the same way. I understand that beehaw follows its own path and goals and it’s genuinely what I like about this instance. I love the moderation and the fact that you all dont put up with BS from users trying to bait you into semantic wars or drama about free speech. I like that the main rule is just be(e) nice and that as a major instance on lemmy it does help set a tone.

That said I dont know if I’d follow beehaw off the fediverse.

HappyMeatbag,
@HappyMeatbag@beehaw.org avatar

Short answer for me is that I joined for a civil place on the Threadiverse not a walled garden. So if you guys leave the Threadiverse I will have to find a new home.

It hurts to admit, but my initial reaction is similar. A completely defederated Beehaw is much less appealing.

HalJor,
@HalJor@beehaw.org avatar

FWIW, I’m appreciating the space for what it is and don’t see the immediate benefits of federation. Hang in there.

gaytswiftfan,

Wherever it leads I’ll follow !

DataDecay,
@DataDecay@beehaw.org avatar

If the goal of beehaw is that the user base remain ever small, then by all means jump ship and move on, I can respect that and I wish you all the best. However unless your good faith “rockstars” are planning on building you a platform, you will likely find out that the grass is not always greener on the other side, and that migrations bring additional tensions and work.

loops,

I’m not sure what it is really, but postmill exists. Another of my favourite post-reddit sites uses it; raddle.me.

Fizz,
@Fizz@lemmy.nz avatar

If this is an issue with people spinning up malicious instances. Could you switch to a whitelist of federated instances? Beehaw feels like the heart of lemmy and it would be a shame to see it go.

mattomattic,

Possibly something like LemmyBB could be an answer. Stay on Fediverse and get to isolate ( I think).

Ategon,
@Ategon@programming.dev avatar

LemmyBB is just an alternate frontend. It is possible to not federate with any other instances though by turning federation off in the instance settings

mattomattic,

Cool, I’m quite fond of the old school format.

PaddleMaster,

May I suggest pinning this for more visibility?

Whatever the decision is, it’s important that everyone knows what’s going on. Whatever the outcome, I’ll stay/move to wherever Beehaw resides. I enjoy the space and vibe that’s created here.

WtfEvenIsExistence,

Wait what? Noooo please don’t leave us 😥

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