Sorry, this is the case on both sides. I’m a leftist, and I see it happen from my side all the time. Deflecting and claiming only Republicans do it is ignorant or blatant gaslighting.
I’m called a nazi sometimes from people in my own party. It 100% happens.
As a leftist myself (not a communist), I’ve found that the biggest difference for now is that I’m not seeing censorship against anyone politically right of Bernie Sandars, (other than downvotes). I don’t care if Lemmy leans left and/or commie, but I hate it when someone behind the scenes decides whether or not I should be able to debate/talk to my political opposites. The reddit censorship was super frustrating, especially when the goalposts of what’s offensive keeps moving.
You claimed in an earlier comment that those of us against communism outright lie to reach our claims. I honestly didn’t think you’d get offended if I suggested the same of you, so I apologize if I offended you.
Your willingness to cut off our conversation due to being offended over the suggestion you might be lying to yourself is pretty convenient. I was hoping you’d read what I wrote and think about it. You don’t have to change your views or beliefs, certainly, but engaging in these conversations is how you hone and are able to defend your beliefs on general.
I understand that up until now, Lemmy has been mostly made of anti-capitalists, so it can be jarring when pro-capitolists flood the space and push back against what’s essentially been an anti-capitalist circle-jerk. Totally understandable.
Okay, what’s one of them, though? Can you point to a country that currently has this going on? I’m not trying to do a gotcha here, I’m genuinely curious.
Lol. You definitely misunderstood. I didn’t say in my comment that TOT was okay because now they have cassinos. I’m not sure how you could possibly get that out of what I wrote. The claim I’m arguing against is that capitalism has caused more deaths than communism, which isn’t the case. Especially since capitalism wasn’t America’s economic governing factor until - yup - the 1860. Capitalism wasn’t the cause of the TOT, but it was the cause of the survivors ability to create weather for their tribes.
Again, because you somehow twisted what I wrote into saying it’s okay that all those people died because casinos, the TOT was horrific. It shouldn’t have happened. Nothing can make up for that, even the wealth made by their survivors. But none of that was due to capitalism.
And no, I wasn’t ignoring everything else you pointed to in terms of deaths under capitalism, because slavery and other horrors certainly were due to capitalism here in America. Though, it has nothing against rhe numbers stacked under communist rule.
I’ll also point out that it’s not like capitalism was absent one day in America, and then suddenly it was governing the country. Capitalism, like most forms of economic rulings, was a slow creep. It happened in small stages until the 1860s, when it became the dominating force in America.
You seem to be outright lying (to yourself, perhaps?) In the face of evidence against your claims. Communism only provides “more democratic results that represent the people” in a utopian setting, of which Hungary under communism certainly did not. The artical outright states that the people behind the dissatisfaction numbers believe they don’t have a democracy, which makes so much sense now that u/maynarkh has explained that the very same elite under under communist rule solidified themselves into Hungary’s new government. Jesus. No wonder they’re unsatisfied.
Listen, I know it’s no fun to have your beliefs shaken, heaven knows that’s happened to me a few times and it sucks. But instead of digging your heels in and trying to twist the words of the articles you linked that you honestly believed backed up your claims, either find ones that actually do, or drop this one, cause anyone with a brain can figure out it actually doesnt.
They didn’t say you’re American, they’re saying you’re applying US patterns to places you don’t understand, which you certainly don’t have to be American to do.
It 100% does not even come close. Not saying those deaths weren’t terrible or unavoidable, absolutely not.
But also, you can’t blame a capitolistic society for trail of tears or any other mass genocide that came before that. We didn’t become capitolistic until 10 years after Trail of Tears ended.
Edit to add: granted, that doesn’t say much about how Native Americans were treated post TOT. Though, it’s certainly through capitalism that Indian casinos have become so successful. 245 tribes own casinos today, all of which rake in the funds.
Do you think he’s the end of the line? It doesn’t matter who’s in his position, they’ll be making the same choices he does, because he answers to the shareholders.