Removed Kbin.social communities

Hello everyone,

Recently we have been dealing with a lot of spam from the kbin.social communities. There is a bug in kbin where moderation tasks are not federated to other instances. That means even if a moderator over at kbin removes a post, it will still be visible on Lemmy instances and it’s up to the instance admins to clean it up.

There have been talks about this in the Lemmy admin channels with some instances considering defederating from kbin.social - and others who have already made that step.

We don’t want to defederate, because we know this would impact the kbin community greatly - but we have to do something. That’s why we have currently removed most of the kbin communities from Lemmy World, making them unavailable to our users. But the kbin users can still view and interact with our communities and users.

This means that those spam-accounts will stil be able to post in our communities too, but at least it makes the task of moderation already a little bit lighter on our team. But it was either this or defederation. The moderation tools on kbin are in an even worse state then Lemmy’s.

We will keep monitoring the situation and will keep you up to date should anything change.

We hope you understand and support our decision.

The Lemmy World team

Elevator7009,

Thanks for not cutting us off. I sub and post to a lot of lemmy.world communities, some of them small, and wouldn’t want to have to stop contributing or make a new Lemmy account.

CascadeDismayed,
@CascadeDismayed@lemmy.world avatar

Keep fighting the good fight boys. It’s only a matter of time until either of these websites surpass all the others. Is there a way I can donate?

dinckelman,

That’s a shame, but it is what needs to be done

jacktherippah,

Good transparency. Thank you for your work!

TCB13,
@TCB13@lemmy.world avatar

I don’t get what’s the obsession with SPAM in the lemmy world. Just let thing settle for themselves or continue down the defederation route and end up without users and/or with a meaningless presence on the web as a platform :)

BaumGeist,

Small communities are still meaningful to community members. Cutting off useless appendages doesn’t make a platform worse because “less users,” that’s a “quantity > quality” mindset which has been proven demonstrably untrue by all of the large social media brands that currently exist

Arguably a “meaningless presence on the web” is a good thing, because it doesn’t incentivize people to join who are just in it for the memes and shitposts but don’t give a damn about the community.

TCB13,
@TCB13@lemmy.world avatar

that’s a “quantity > quality” mindset which has been proven demonstrably untrue by all of the large social media brands that currently exist

Yet those platform thrive and grow, including Reddit white Lemmy is what it is.

Arguably a “meaningless presence on the web” is a good thing,

Yes, until you’ve to go into Reddit because there’s no content and/or people here that might reply to you.

BaumGeist,

Yet those platform thrive and grow

Yes because they’ve focused more on quantity than quality.

including Reddit

I rest my case

until you’ve to go into Reddit because there’s no content and/or people here

Idk if we’re talking about the same platform, but the reddit I was on for years had 2 major kinds of communities:

  1. Loud shouting matches with tons of no-effort content drowning out the quality discussions, where people with the worst opinion or stalest jokes struggle to be top comment
  2. Small communities that get a handful of new posts per week, where the community is engaging but relatively inactive.

Now these two aren’t exactly mutually exclusive, so there were small dogshit subs and >100k subs that were enjoyable (as long as you avoided the comments).

What I realized was that the smaller communities weren’t generally better because the people were a different breed, but—because of the slow pace and small size—people didn’t feel driven to treat it like a popularity contest; those who did would get frustrated and act out until they were kicked or blocked by the majority. It wasn’t all sunshine and rainbows, but it was still better than the large communities.

I’ve blocked !memes, which means I’m limited to the second kind of communities here.

fushuan,

I don’t get what’s the obsession with SPAM in the lemmy world.

Maybe because you are not moderating and it’s not taking your free time to do so.

TCB13,
@TCB13@lemmy.world avatar

Just let it be… or use something automated like Akismet.

jarfil,

Instance admins can’t “just let it be”, they’re responsible for whatever they let users publish on the instance.

Akismet is a centralized system with price tiers depending on API call volume… kind of unfit for a decentralized platform, and too similar to why people ran away from Reddit.

TCB13,
@TCB13@lemmy.world avatar

Fire up something open-source instead. Even the engine behind rspamd would work for lemmy.

kmkz_ninja,

Which domains are least likely to ban you for equivalating using statistics to cull animals to eugenics and trepanning?

I think .world is slowly transitioning towards reddit.shitty. in how heavy handed the moderation is. Interesting that comments advocatin for the literal murder of cops is allowed but saying “13 % of dogs commit 90% of crime” is a bannable offense.

Which domains have the least arbitrary moderation tools?

Also: Cops are generally pigs.

Or: To put things on topic. .World has made relatively unilateral decisions regarding the health of the domain. Which domains have a more democratic regard for what is and isn’t appropriate? If lemmy is going to be a more poorly paid Reddit, I’d rather go to the place with more than 1 new commented-on post per hour.

DigitalPortkey,

Congrats on not reading the post at all and writing something that literally has nothing to do with this thread.

It takes a special level of determination to be so completely clueless.

JackSkellington,

I also noticed there was a lot of spam from kbin regarding the online sales of pharmacy drugs that require prescriptions.

hoch,

https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/7df4e59e-51ca-4261-9658-49d1f39bef2b.jpeg

PmMeFrogMemes,

i mean theres so many kbin communities, which one???

Anonymousllama,

There’s been a heap of development going on with kbin recently, with a release upcoming. Overall the development process has been a bit slow with Ernest (the guy who owns the project) having personal issues to resolve.

Definitely the moderation process needs to be improved so that we have better ways of addressing spam so it doesn’t bother other instances.

Personally I’m of the opinion that we should be using a metric based system where we weigh in the users date or creation, overall interactivity, upvote / downvote ratio and other data to potentially flag spam users. But honestly fighting spam is really hard and all of that would have to be built (plus it’s a public repo so bad actors could look for how this is pieced together and find new ways to get past)

KingThrillgore,
@KingThrillgore@lemmy.ml avatar

I’m worried kbin development is stalling.

petunia,

Spam has consistently been the death of the open internet, even the big tech silos struggle with spam (Instagram for example – despite having incredibly invasive techniques for identifying “genuine” users – is STILL inundated with spam commenters). I think instances on the fediverse should reconsider their open registration policy, either totally close registrations when you reach an agreed upon critical mass of users, or adopt some form of invitation or application system for new users. I believe Mastodon supports both in the software.

Candelestine, (edited )

I agree. A hard limit would be a good idea, it’d nip a lot of problems in the bud.

I’m as idealist as the next guy, but I was also a hellacious misfit once, so I know what it feels like to be a hate-fueled asshole. I really hope these Fediverse idealists have started to understand that assholes do exist, and they must take measures to defend themselves.

Combat is a part of life. Violence is an aspect of competitive biology. You’re gonna have to deal with attacks here. Forever. Just get the fuck used to it, you’re at war and will be until you die or leave this place. Largely due to politics and the way open communication has not just empowered good people to create good things, but has also empowered extremists and criminals too. And they exist and have goals too, in case any of you people fucking forgot.

theangryseal,

Well, shit. I had totally forgotten.

I’m making a note now.

For real though. You’ve summed it up pretty good here.

vodichar,

I saw a punnet of really big grapes today. It was very cool; I’ve never seen grapes that big! Do you reckon they would’ve been like, suuuper juicy?

Draconic_NEO,
@Draconic_NEO@lemmy.world avatar

I think it would be a good idea to introduce limited Federation like what they have on Mastodon into lemmy, where communities from that Instance wouldn’t be federated unless explicitly allowed by the Admins of the Instance who put said block in place. It wouldn’t be good for all cases but it could work for ones like this where the communities are the problem and the majority of the users there are fine.

nbafantest,

Is it all the communities? If theres still some kbin social communities on here, does that mean its probably not part of the troublesome communities and probably wont get removed?

mojo,

Devs learning in real time why social media (especially decentralized) should be designed moderation first in design.

MaxVoltage,

i went to kbin the other day its not cool lile lemmy

cypher_greyhat,

War were declared.

linearchaos,
@linearchaos@lemmy.world avatar

And this ham gum social media account is all bones

killeronthecorner,
@killeronthecorner@lemmy.world avatar

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