Laws protecting fetuses should involve protecting women against domestic violence, and the suffering caused by losing a pregnancy through violence/another person’s negligence
That’s already the case what are you on about.
Also, I’m not terribly concerned with what international courts and governments think about fetuses being people, I think they’re wrong.
I’m not terribly concerned what you think about fetuses being people: Not only are you wrong your arguments also are just as poor as the Roe vs. Wade reasoning.
A person can sustain it’s own life without needing the body of another person
Which would mean that personhood starts at the age of what, six or so? Certainly not before birth. Which means you’re arguing for severely late-term abortions.
See I don’t infantilise women like that, I don’t think that women take the better part of nine months to make up their mind.
If she knowingly went into the desert […]
No. She got lost. Don’t change my fucking argument. Getting lost in the desert and having a miscarriage both fall under “shit happens”: No blame. Moreover, saying “women with certain medical conditions are not allowed to get pregnant, they must be sterilised” is fucking inhumane. Nature doesn’t always follow our aesthetic preferences and the woman’s desire to have a kid is just as valid as everyone else’s, and murder isn’t about aesthetics but intent. A woman getting pregnant is not intent to kill that doesn’t even start to make sense.
The medical system, of course, would try to coax her into pre-implantation diagnostics, adoption, and whatnot. Which is where that particular problem belongs: In the medical and social, not legal, realm.
I mean, I guess counseling would stop people from getting abortions on a whim, because they’re having a bad day.
Counselling is meant to inform about all the medical stuff (if necessary), and show up possible paths forwards. If “having a bad day” means “got fired from job, partner got fired, too, and also the washing machine broke and flooded the apartment” then yes that’s very much a thing that counselling is meant to address: Physical and financial security won’t be an issue for the kid. The state got your back.
In America, low-wage workers generally don’t get paid time off or sick leave
…that’s an America problem. We don’t have American conditions in Germany so don’t try to make them an argument.
But involving the justice system in another person’s (bad) choices always produces good results, no? That’s why you were arguing self-administered abortions should be criminalized in Germany, so the justice system can help them.
Helping pregnant women is not task of the justice system, that’s responsibility of the health and social services. No court is getting involved.
In fact side note: The constitutional court considered resolving the rights conflict between growing and existing life on a case-by-case basis before court, they very quickly and emphatically dismissed that notion as being a privacy nightmare and thus the final call – whether the rights conflict can be resolved in favour of the woman – is up to the woman. Counselling makes sure that she’s got all the relevant information to make that call, and the three days cooldown provide time to make it as well as bring heart and mind into alignment.
And before you think otherwise: It is illegal to pressure women during counselling.
I find it incredibly difficult to believe that the criminalization of the acts of desperate women to be uncontroversial
If you’re starving and walk into a bakery and steal bread you’ll also get sentenced – to a slap on the wrist, and the court is going to make sure that you’ll get the help necessary for that to not occur again, help that was available to you and you should have accepted before you got into that situation. Likewise, states are required to make abortions accessible so women not having ready access to them doesn’t occur. (Hence also my railing about Bavaria, our local backwater. Though the situation there is probably still better than in random blue US states).
On the flipside, if a woman goes ahead and says “I don’t like the way Germany regulates abortions, I’m going to spend two weeks educating myself about abortions and another two to get the supplies, then do it myself just to show them who’s boss” – that is what the upper end of the punishment range is for. In that time span you could’ve gotten that abortion using regular channels, easily.
Oh and just for completeness’ sake: All this is about at-will abortions, abortions for medical or criminal reasons are covered by self-defence,