Give me my private Dining Room back you Talaxian cockroach ( startrek.website )

lugal , 10 months ago

???

He stayed there because he finally found his people and was honored as a ambassador in the delta quadrant (what ever that means). He was very happy to stay there and the crew qas happy for him.

Stamets OP , 10 months ago

Well, he didn’t so much ‘finally find his people’ as just saw a bunch of Talaxians and assumed it would be the last group of them he’d ever see. Talaxians were throughout the show so Neelix wasn’t exactly trying to find home or anything. Also he wasn’t really ‘honored’ as an Ambassador as straight up employed by Starfleet as one. They never explored it in the show but in Star Trek Online his being an ambassador makes a considerable difference to the quadrant. Then again how much of that is canon is anyones guess.

That being said, as much as I genuinely love Neelix, I think the meme still stands. After 7 years on Voyager, being there since they first arrived in the Delta Quadrant, he’s dropped off at the Talaxian colony and then is scarcely mentioned again. The next episode he has billing in the credits but he’s only mentioned by one character. The episode after that is the series finale and he has zero impact in that as well. Just ends up playing a game with Seven for 2 minutes and is never seen again or even mentioned again.

ptz , 10 months ago

The next episode he has billing in the credits but he’s only mentioned by one character

Wasn’t he playing Kadis-kot with Naomi on video chat in that episode? Granted, it was basically a cameo so your point still stands (unless I’m remembering wrong).

Stamets OP , 10 months ago

I had to double-check when making the initial comment (my memory is ass) but nope. Endgame does have a scene where he’s playing Kadis-Kot over video but that’s with Seven of Nine. Memory Alpha also has him written down as not appearing in the episode, Renaissance Man. This is their blurb on it.

• Ethan Phillips (Neelix) does not appear in this episode. He left Voyager in “Homestead”, the previous episode. However, he is mentioned in dialogue by The Doctor and remains in the opening credits.

Hilariously, Naomi was also completely forgotten about the second Neelix left Voyager. Her last appearance was with Neelix in the same episode he departed. He talks to her for a couple minutes (helping him to realize he probably should leave Voyager) and she’s seen for a moment at the end when Neelix is leaving the ship.

ptz , 10 months ago

Ah, OK. So I was a bit off ( been a while). I did remember kadiskot but mixed up the episode and who he was playing it with.

Stamets OP , 10 months ago

All good! Pretty easy to jumble stuff up after 7 seasons of it. I don’t blame you in the slightest. Like I said, I had to doublecheck with Memory Alpha too.

lugal , 10 months ago

and then is scarcely mentioned again.

Something happened and it was no impact on the following episodes?? In Voyager??? From all we know, he might be taking care of the lizard babies.

But seriously: at least after the “big expand” (was it called like this?) there are no talaxians anymore and he’s happy to meet his kind again. My head canon is that Neelix always has titles that mean essentially nothing (like cook on a star ship with replicators, moral officer, …) and he gets these to feel valued and accepted. When he decides to leave, he’s like: I have all these important things to do here, I can’t leave the crew behind. And Janeway is like: let me give you a new important sounding title.

And not being mentioned in the final is just Voyager being Voyager. And even in universe: the story is packed already. He could be involved in the anniversary but even that doesn’t bother me too much. He might be busy.

But that’s just my interpretation and I’m not too much into the material. I haven’t watched Voyager for years.

Stamets OP , 10 months ago (edited 10 months ago)

No idea what you mean by Big Expand unless you’re talking about the Nekrit Expanse. There was a pretty big gap between when he saw his last group of Talaxians, sure, but it’s not like he was ever seeking them out to begin with.

Neelix’s titles actually do mean stuff though. His being a cook actually is quite important. Replicators use a VAST amount of energy to make things and the entire crew have replicator rations/tokens. They end up using those as like betting chips in some episodes. Neelix helps Voyager scavenge food from various planets and then cooks that food for the crew. While he did take it upon himself to just randomly start doing it, it was an eventual necessity and one that helped the ship deal with it’s energy reserves more effectively. Janeway also didn’t even promote him to Ambassador in the episode he left. She promoted him to Ambassador in Season 3 during the Nekrit Expanse arc. It just got solidified when he left because now Starfleet needed an ambassador, not just Voyager.

You say the story is packed already but I don’t think it is. He spent 7 years with this crew trying to help them get home and there’s not even a call from the Alpha Quadrant, showing him a picture of Earth? Not even a 5 second scene where he reacts to them getting home in anyway? In Admiral Janeways future he’s not even mentioned at all. Like zero consideration of his existence. No line about “I miss Neelix’s cooking”. No nothing. Like I said. I stand by the meme as a Neelix lover who has Voyager as his #3 favorite Trek show.

Edit: What is your insistence on downvoting me, within seconds of responding, for simply disagreeing with you? Come on. You’re better than this. This isn’t reddit. People can have a discussion and disagreements without resorting to something so petty.

lugal , 10 months ago

Edit: What is your insistence on downvoting me, within seconds of responding, for simply disagreeing with you?

Let me start here since this is important: I don’t get push notifications and only see your comments much later, in this case 40min. I don’t know you downvotes you and I see how you think it’s me, but it’s not me. I didn’t downvote a single comment or post from you and I’m happy to agree to disagree and learn a lot from you. I hope you believe me.

That out of the way, let me go on disagreeing with you in a productive way, hopefully =)

Nekrit Expanse

Yes, that’s what I meant. It’s been years and it’s not my native language so sorry for the confusion.

as a Neelix lover

I would also consider myself a Neelix fan but I have a different reading of him: He starts as the sneaky deal maker who tries very hard to give back to the crew because he thinks they will send him away the moment they don’t need him anymore. Janeway reacts to this by giving him tasks and purpose even tho star fleet is way advanced. That’s why he tries to get a map of the Nekrit Expanse. He was the guy who knew around and now they get into territory that’s even new for him. That’s when it clicks for him that he’s valuable just for existing and doesn’t have to justify his presence, still he gets a new meaningless title (ambassador) but he’s not afraid of losing everything anymore. That’s my interpretation. I totally get yours.

I thought you wanted him to play a role in the final but now that I think about it, you are right, he should have been mentioned at least. Communication to the gamma quadrant is still not straight forward, but some kind of honoring should have happened.

And to the guy who keeps downloading you: stop it. You aren’t siting with me by doing that.

JungleJim , 10 months ago

If I’m understanding you correctly, Neelix is in 2 of the last 3 episodes. He has a starring role in one, a guest appearance in one, and isn’t in the finale. That seems pretty “included” to me up til the very end. If Neelix had been included in the finale I can’t see how it would have been much more than another cameo, perhaps waving goodbye to the ship over subspace as it dove into the transwarp conduit.

Also, I like your memes; I see your content a lot. Thanks for contributing so much.

Stamets OP , 10 months ago

The issue is more that he had a starring role in every episode and then was cut out of the last two. He has a cameo in the finale but it’s only for a few moments and not even waving goodbye. It’s a random throwaway line of conversation with Seven of Nine. He was with them for 7 entire years and then vanished. Didn’t even say goodbye to Voyager as it left the Delta Quadrant and presumably doesn’t even know it left until much later. There’s no payoff. The whole time he’s helping Voyager get home, being the Morale Officer to help them feel less homesick, and he doesn’t even get the courtesy of being excited for his new family and happy that they finally got home. Just feels really shitty to me to do that. Sure, it would have just been a cameo, but it would have been a payoff to the characters involvement instead of saying “Don’t worry, even though you’re not on the ship you’re still part of our family” and then not giving him an emotional moment like the crew had.

And thanks <3 I just spam Star Trek stuff to get new people on board. Actually a temporal agent in disguise trying to fix a fractured timeline. Shh.

JungleJim , 10 months ago

I see what you mean, and I wish we could have had more Neelix, as I really do like him as a character, more than even Tuvix (why couldn’t Janeway just transporter clone Tuvix and then disassemble one?). I just personally think it’d be having our cake and eating it too in order to both put his character arc at a conclusion or resting point, and get to see him with Voyager to the last moment.

Neelix was always a wanderer, and since his planet was assaulted and his people genocidally attacked to the point of a thin diaspora, he was really adrift. Kes’s kindness and love (as weird as it is) cracked his shell enough for him to be able to try trusting Voyager when he first meets it. Voyager teaches him to open up. Kes leaving teaches him to let go. Learning to let go let’s him process the tragedy of the loss of his family. Through the strength of self he’s gained on Voyager, through learning to love and nurture Naomi Wildman and to serve as part of the crew, Neelix has become a whole person again, but not without scars. When he met a holdout group of Talaxians with no real leadership, he saw an echo of the family and culture he’d lost before Voyager. It wasn’t that he felt Voyager no longer needed him, he was still very worried about that and as you said, they needed their chef, and morale officer. But those Talaxians would probably die without his help.

That’s what Starfleet taught Neelix; that in order to save his new friends, he has to make them his family. In order to save his new family, he has to say goodbye to family one who helped heal him. The crew’s reaction wasn’t one of indifference to his departure. It was one of acceptance, and letting Neelix know it was okay to accept this new responsibility to his new family. That despite their love for him, the needs of the many outweighed the needs of the few. Or the one.

JungleJim , 10 months ago

Well I love your combination of humor with deeper lore appreciation. It makes it fun for newbies like myself.