@futurebird this is a really big distinction and it's hard to not be on one "side" or the other - the right is trying "to win". But what does it mean when the left declares moderate candidates like Biden and even...Pelosi (horrors!), who "can win", to be total non-starters; the only way forward is "overthrow the whole system" - which is how these various 3rd party candidates come about, who essentially work against the D's in states that dont have ranked choice