Biden’s poll numbers aren’t looking great at the moment. If any significant number of people that otherwise would have been Biden voters sit out the election, Biden loses. It doesn’t even have to be voters that had previously voted for him voting for Trump (which is unlikely, since Trump strongly supports Israel’s genocidal ambitions as well). They just have to… Not show up.
And yeah, a Biden loss would be far worse for the country–and for Palestinians, and for Ukranians–than a Biden win. But voters that feel ignored aren’t likely to care; after all, if you don’t feel like the president gives a shit about your views, then does it really matter which of the two shitty choices wins?
To be clear - I’m pissed at Dems. I’m angry that Biden isn’t being a lot more forceful about climate change, that he isn’t take a take-no-prisoners approach to Republicans’ nonsense over the budget, that he’s caving in to Israel, that he’s not sending Ukrain the weapons they need to drive Russia into the Pacific, and so much more. And yet, shit gets worse a lot faster under Trump. We need to turn around; Biden is gently tapping the brakes, and Trump would put a brick on the gas pedal.
Things are changing so fast. Before Gaza kicked off, I would have said it’s unlikely people were willingly to endure and fours years with the Orange Cancer. Now, I am not so sure. TBH if you dared have an opposing opinion about not supporting Israel, you were shouted down and called anti semite. I think the Democrats were taken by surprise by large swaths of the population that are against the extermination of a population. You can’t justify killing vulnerable unarmed citizens and children during a campaign. It would be a mistake for Biden to run again. Old rich people really do not give a fuck about outcomes… too insulated and really have nothing to lose. The common people will suffer for decades.
Why would anybody want the Orange Cancer, when the reality is that Palestine, Israel, Ukraine and the US all lose from that situation? Russia and Iran win. Is that really a valid strategy just to protest against Israel?
Are they aware that in doing so they will lose their democracy? Because if they are aware of that, I don’t see how sitting it out is morally defensible by any metric.
I am completely aware of that, and I’m hoping that things get fascist enough that it leads to a revolution. If not, I still have my “easy out” Nitrogen gas bag.
Even if leads to a revolution, the people opposed to fascism lose in a few days or weeks, because they’re the same people that have actively campaigned against the individual right to keep and bear arms for 40 years now. Dems refuse to accept that the freedoms they value are built on the willingness of the people–as a whole–to use violence as a tool. Republicans are more than happy to use violence to oppress.
The revolution used in your example, appears to rely on the division of repubs and dems. That isn’t the type of revolution I’m speaking of or the one that I want. I’m talking about that sweet class warfare baby. I want the one where the working class finally wakes up, realizes division is a submission tactic, the former pubs lend the former dems some firearms, and we all go hunt the wealthy. It would probably require +10 years of fascist rule though. Like enough fascism that it causes “good christian southern white folk” to go “what the fuck is going on?”
Now personally, if we can’t get our collective shit together, I’m probably gonna give myself the “ol curtain call” anywhere between 5-20 years from now (Depending on how terrible project 2025 turns out for my demographic). In the meantime, I do plan on obtaining a firearm, just in case we decide to eat the rich within that timeframe.
I want the one where the working class finally wakes up,
That is unlikely to happen. While I’ve certainly spoken to a number of younger people at shooting events that would agree that it’s a class issue rather than a left/right thing, most of the people that I’ve run across do not see it that way. They have the simple view, “Republican good, Demonrats bad”. (BTW, I do tend to vote Democratic, because there are many things that I value that the Dems at least say they’re in favor of, even if they usually don’t act. Lesser of two evils, etc.)
Like enough fascism that it causes “good christian southern white folk”
Uh. Who, exactly, do you think the fascists are? Odds are pretty good that if you’re in a white SBC church, any megachurch at all, TradCath, or some other similar trash, you’re probably rootin’ for the fascists. As the saying goes, there’s no hate like Christian love.
In the meantime, I do plan on obtaining a firearm,
I’m down with that. Take some classes, and take classes from people that have a solid track record as competitive shooters, not some old fudd that kisses the NRA’s ass. (Ben Stoeger is the gold standard for shooting instructors; if you’re LGBTQ+, check Operation Blazing Sword or The Pink Pistols for LGBTQ+ friendly instructors.) Practice and train regularly, and compete. You don’t git gud shooting at slow firing at paper targets; you get good by forcing yourself to shoot accurately while moving and on the clock. Steel challenge is a good place to start, and then USPSA and IDPA. You don’t need a gucci gun, you just need something that’s accurate and reliable. Glock is the standard for a reason; you can run them for thousands of rounds without cleaning, while race guns (like Staccato) need to be cleaned every 750-1000 rounds or else they start jamming badly. In fact, for IDPA, you can’t use the gucci-est of gucci race guns; production optics is as fancy as it goes, and you’re going to have to be able to conceal it. Get a carry permit; you don’t have to carry–I don’t, because I simply don’t need to–but having the permit and knowing the laws on when you can carry, and when you can legally use lethal self defense is generally a good idea.
…And then hope to fuck that we can hold it together as a country, and turn this shit around without a class war, because US Civil War Pt II would be the bloodiest war in human history, and the world that would emerge after that war isn’t one that I’d want to live in, regardless of who “won”.
Yeah, its wishful thinking. Especially on the “southern christo-fash sees the error of their ways” part of my comment. Your firearm advice is dope af, I would not have thought to go to that type of training.
Depends, do they want to contribute to even more genocide globally (how many Russians and Ukranians have died this week?) It seems imbalanced to life itself to risk way more lives globally in favor of one group on the planet. Does that seem incorrect?
I don’t think everyone thinks like that. Whatever choice that is fine with their thinking and how most likely they can benefit seems to be the default mode.
Literally can’t believe this. It’s just another instance of a few loudmouths shooting off making empty threats. “Young activists” aren’t going to swing anything and “polls” don’t mean shit. 24 is an easy choice because it’s the same one as 20, we’ve got dumb and dumber but dumber is now an unhinged fascist so ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Seriously. “Young activists” aren’t voting anyway. And if they think Biden is bad, wait until they hear about the other guy. Single-issue voters are idiots probably better off not voting.
This would be scary except for the part where I think many of these young activists would honestly rather have their whole search history read in court than vote for Trump.
If it’s those two guys again, the election will go exactly the same way as last time, because 99.9% of Americans will have already decided before the first presidental debate even happens.
I know I’ve already decided that I’m not gonna bother come 2024 if those two are back. But I’m more apathetic about politics than the average Tlaib listener. They will almost certainly fall in line the instant the primaries are clinched.
If everything else that directly threatened their futures and lives didn’t get them out to vote, surely this wouldn’t. I hope they do, but if the youth only shows up to vote for non-Americans futures instead of their own, it’d be the saddest shit ever.
Honestly, I could probably see this being the first time in history where an incumbent loses the primary. If not now, then I’m sure it’ll happen in my lifetime.
We won’t know with Harris because she’s extremely unpopular regardless of her sex. Her losing anything is only evidence of how unpopular she is individually.
Hamas: actually tries a genocide, to kill as many civilians as possible Israel: responds with a heavy hand, but obviously not intentionally murdering civilians
Lets be realistic, if Israel wanted to, they could commit an actual genocide, and essentially kill nearly all Palestinians, its within their capabilities.
Hamas wishes they could do the same, but they can’t, so they get a pass? The fact that people can’t see that very obvious distinction, and call what Israel is doing a genocide is alarming.
I’m going to ignore your bad faith argument that what Hamas did in any way compares in scale to what Israel is doing and try to argue on your level.
If Israel was more immediate with it’s long term plans then it would just lead to war with the neighboring nations. Imaging swatting a wasp nest inside of a room built out of wasp nests. It’s a really stupid plan that doesn’t benefit anybody. What Israel is doing currently is already walking the knife’s edge on the maximum amount of harm they can get away with.
Eastern propaganda: Jews deserve to be eliminated so its OK that they are being bombarded daily by terrorists while ordinary citizens are being held hostage
Only one side wants genocide. Only one side benefits from dead Palestinian civilians.
US bases are being attacked now constantly, where is the outcry from the world for people to stop attacking Americans? Just because we have the ability to defend ourselves, its OK for people to shoot at us?
2023: Totally cool and normal for people to want to kill Jews and Americans now apparently.
If the “young activists” would passively or actively help Trump regain presidency, they’re terrorists that shouldn’t be bargained with. The grown-ups see Biden wary of losing Jewish support but still daring to broach the topic of Gaza Human Rights, words that wouldn’t come out of a conservative’s mouth in a thousand years.
I don’t give a shit if trump or biden is in office, both support genocide and imperialism. You like biden because you get to pretend the world makes sense now due to not seeing them post on twitter.
If it is Trump vs. Biden again in 2024, America will have gone 12 years without having someone under the age of retirement on the general ballot. Clinton, Bush, and Trump were all born the same year, with Biden being born 2 years before the three. Of course they all see Palestinians as terrorists, Cubans as rulled by Castro, socialists as Russia supporters, and drugs use as reefer mandness.
Obama was a breath of fresh air because he was finally from a generation that was passed all that. Why can’t we find someone else from the next generation to run against Biden in the primary?
“Obama was a breath of fresh air because he was finally from a generation that was passed all that” I say getting reduced to red mist after obama drone strikes me and my wife in the maternity ward (they were hiding future combatants)
At least that is a new moral quandary with new technology. The guy after Obama heard that the Chinese were pointing microwave beams at the White House windows measuring vibrations caused by sound in the rooms - and then turned around and said the Chinese are hiding microphones in his microwave oven.
I don’t think it’s just a matter of age. Plenty of old people don’t support genocide or fascism.
And Obama isn’t a point in favor of that, because he also kept arming Israel, exercising PATRIOT Act powers, kept up all the U.S.'s wars as long as possible, and killing people by the thousands with drone strikes.
We have a problem with authoritarianism. Call it like it is. The 30-50 year old representatives support it, the 70 year old representatives support it.
Fucking right?! As much as Biden sucks, the alternative is soooooo much fucking worse for the Palestinian people, there is no telling what the US response would have been if 45 was still in office. Mfs forgot so fast how 45 wanted a straight up Muslim ban, and now Republicans are trying to expel Palestinian visas in the US. Shit would be 10x worse if the Republicans were in control of the executive branch.
“Well being genocided sucks and i really hate having to collect the remains of my children every day for burial but I rest easy knowing that the alternative is worse” - a grateful palestinian about to die screaming as they’re doused in white phosphorus
Can you blame them? People only voted for Biden in 2020 because he wasn’t Trump. If the DNC can’t even present another inspiring candidate, we should maybe consider being frustrated with the party itself and not take our anger out on everyone else.
It’s tough. A 2-party system where one party wants to end democracy feels like it’s already not much of a democracy at all. I can understand the frustration of having to vote the mediocre technocrat as “the lesser evil” each election. On the other hand, the prospect of a second Trump presidency is horrifying and would be a disaster for far more countries than just the US, so I’d still vote for Biden every time if I could.
Please vote Not Trump again. I can’t deal with another 5 years of seeing that twat in the headlines unless he is having his fraudulent businesses dismantled and being sent to jail in those headlines.
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