If they can walk, they can bike. If they can’t walk, how safe is it for them to drive a car? Calling a taxi or an ambulance is not out of the question.
America has a love affair with pickup trucks. In 2022, the top three best-selling vehicles in America were pickup trucks, and among them, the Ford F-series reigns supreme. The Ford F-150 has been the best-selling vehicle in the U.S. for more than 40 years, and for that reason, it’s a useful proxy for pickups overall.
It’s worth noting that the success of the F-series isn’t due to the overall popularity of pickups. Pickups have only recently become ~20% of the market. They’ve never been the largest market segment.
Instead, for several reasons pickup sales have been concentrated into comparatively few models for decades.
First, we’ve had a 25% protectionist tarrif on foreign-built pickups since the 60s. The excuse for passing it was as retaliation in a trade war with France and Germany over frozen US factory farmed chicken, so it’s called the chicken tax. So there’s a number of foreign cars and SUVs on the market, but very few foreign pickups.
Second, companies like Ford and Chevy focus their pickup sales into fewer models than SUV/car makers tend to. Ford buckets all of the F150, F250, F350, etc. sales into the “F-series”. The F-series includes 2 door and 4 door trucks, long bed, regular bed and short bed trucks, regular trucks and their luxury trucks, etc. The lions share of trucks they sell are F-series.
Pickups have been getting steadily larger and less practical, sure, and the F150 is a great poster child for the trend. But the fact that pickups are consistently best-selling models has much more to do with industry shenanigans than any real American “love affair” with them.
Or call an ambulance. In some places, sure, Uber or a taxi is the right choice because you can’t afford the ambulance, but societies without universal healthcare have deeply fucked priorities.
Please don’t depend on an inhaler as a rescue medicine… If she is using Albuterol then she needs a controller medication to take every day. Asthma can be life threatening; please make sure she gets effective care.
I’m sorry you had to deal with everything and am so glad you were able to drive to help her. She is lucky to have you.
I have asthma, this is soooo true - sometimes it’ll just flare up hard for seemingly no reason. For me, it’s a combination of stress, environmental allergens, and bad food choices.
I have my fluticasone inhaler for daily maintenance, an Albuterol inhaler for attacks, and an epi-pen for when the shit hits the fan. I rarely use the Albuterol inhaler and I’ve never used the epi-pen but they’re good to have. Dying by slow suffocation, panicking all the while, would be just the worst way to go.
We tend to avoid them at night, because night fares are expensive and there are safety concerns for women (sexism is so fun 🤬). But, in an emergency they are an option we would consider.
What is the solution then? The problem is probably more that there aren’t enough pharmacists to run 24/7 pharmacies within walking distance of everyone in a city.
Also even cities with great public transport infrastructure have a spotty night schedule or don’t even have one at all. Like even in Tokyo you can get stranded if you miss the last bus/train and then you have to wait till the morning or call a taxi
This situation would have happened in any city , walkable or not, unless you live near a pharmacy that is open at night.
I could rant for ages about the state of public health in my country, but this is not the community for that.
There are a lot of things to be improved on the area of public transportation.
The night routes are not enough, it’s not like the buses are empty. Also, if the metro operated during the night this would have been a 15min trip. Remember autopilot is a thing, night routes shouldn’t be an issue for metro lines.
The bike infrastructure is non existent, a good bike path would make the time to get there about the same as driving a car.
Last but not least, the problem still stands and escalating an issue as simple as picking up a medicine increases the burden on the already overloaded health services.
And this is why I had to put a new motor in my work truck this last winter. It was cheaper to buy a new motor for a 25yo truck then buy even a used 10yo truck. As someone who needs a work truck I hate the mall trucks just as much as the rest of you.
I don’t know if you really want a “swap” here, so much as a “speed limit all of these, or maybe ban two of them.” If you get on a scooter with a max speed of 118MPH what you’re actually doing is committing suicide.
You are derailing. This post is not about faster scooters. This post is a about absurdly overpowered tanks that can (and do) wreck havoc without being limited in any considerate way.
The entire premise is a bad faith argument, that you need to “swap” anything. You can have BOTH of them GPS speed limited. There is absolutely no reason why ALL vehicles should not be speed limited when operated in proximity to pedestrians.
The “swap” in the title artificially introduce a false dichotomy. The premise is intrinsically bad faith. My initial comment was incredibly measured, all things considering.
You don’t need to GPS limit scooters to 8 mph when their top speed of 15 mph is already less than a person running. If they push someone over or hurt them due to negligent use of the scooter, charge them as you would if they’re a pedestrian. Don’t try to make an alternative to driving less appealing when cars in cities (even if GPS limited) are already hundreds of times more dangerous.
I have been injured by a negligent e scooter rider. A human body at sufficient speed is dangerous. You don’t need to be licensed or insured to ride one.
charge them as you would if they’re a pedestrian.
For the identical reason that this a an insufficient response to other vehicles, it’s insufficient here. I don’t want people who hurt me to be punished, I WANT TO BE SAFE.
This has nothing to do with cars.
Some fucker hurt me and I thank god the max speed was limited.
Just because something is an alternative to driving doesn’t automatically mean we should abandon any thought or reason and say “thou art above reproach and thous’t actions in any circumstances must be wise and good”.
Being a scooter driver doesn’t automatically make you not a fucking idiot.
First of all, your Middle English grammar is atrocious, the 2nd-person possessive pronoun is “thine”, not “thous’t”. “Thou’st”* is equivalent to the modern “you’ve”, not “your”, and “you’ve actions” doesn’t make sense.
Second, what makes you think there will be fewer injuries with speed-limited scooters? Wouldn’t you prefer they be fast enough to keep up with bike lane traffic so they don’t have a reason to be on the sidewalks at all? An 8mph scooter can still knock you over, and the fall will be the cause of the bulk of your injuries in both an 8 and 15 mph collision.
I’m not saying that they deserve to be unregulated because they aren’t cars, I’m mad that they’re getting the attention of regulators in a way that doesn’t actually make things safer, and districts from safety issues that really deserve attention.
Wouldn’t you prefer they be fast enough to keep up with bike lane traffic so they don’t have a reason to be on the sidewalks at all?
This presupposes that the only reason they’re on the sidewalks is that they’re too slow for the bike lanes… which presupposes anywhere a scooter rider wants to go has a bike lane in which to travel.
I’m mad that they’re getting the attention of regulators in a way that doesn’t actually make things safer,
I’m empathetic. And I actually agree with you that if there is infrastructure (bike lanes) that are available, then go nuts. That’s the beauty of GPS is that you could conceivably match speed limits to available infrastructure.
And I’d be fine with many alternative mechanisms… maybe you can get some training to understand how to safely ride at higher speeds on sidewalks? Ok. Maybe the scooters have a function to make more noise so pedestrians at least have a prayer of hearing some drunk idiot cruising up behind them? Maybe have a built-in breathalyzer you gotta use after 6pm if you wanna keep the top speeds unlocked?
I’m not unreasonable. I just don’t want to get smoked AGAIN by some drunk asshole going March goddamn 3 on the sidewalk. My safety on a sidewalk shouldn’t be up for negotiation. I think “we can’t enforce any speed limit or else they’ll be shut out of bike lanes” is an extreme conclusion to draw it a lot of big assumptions built into it.
Hey now, off-topic criticisms aren’t bad faith, they’re just bad humor, but I see how that might be misconstrued. I’m not trying to discredit your argument by changing the subject though, so I apologize for that
I think you make some good points about the availability of bike lanes, but I disagree that limiting the speed only where bike lanes are unavailable is a suitable middle ground. I don’t think scooters should be allowed on sidewalks PERIOD. Anywhere I say bike lane, assume “street” if your setting doesn’t have one. And the problem I see is that limiting their speed makes the sidewalk look more appealing than the street, which is my main concern. Scooters should not be available for rental in areas with only bike lanes and fast roads, since there’s not really a good speed to limit them where they’re both useful as a means of transportation and safe for nearby pedestrians. As for the privately owned scooters, increasing the penalties associated with their misuse and promoting public awareness of those penalties will do far more to keep them off sidewalks than to hope the manufacturers implement the proper GPS speed limits and anti-tamper systems.
I’m sorry a drunk scooter driver injured you and I agree that drunk scooter use should be prohibited by some means, but I don’t know how you could attach a breathalyzer to a publicly used vehicle and expect people to put their mouths on it to blow. Drunkenness is a huge problem and our culture around alcohol is a major factor in allowing it to do as much harm as it does.
I think you and I generally agree that scooters are good, and generally agree there is room for improvement in their deployment.
I think we generally believe the speeds in which they operate should be appropriate for their contexts.
I’m pretty sure where our divides are, is just “what are the contexts”, and “is prescriptive law enough?”
I don’t think prescriptive law is enough.we can post speed limits, but they are broken. We can paint bike lane lines, and cars veer into them. Physical barriers are what keep cars out of bike lanes, not paint. GPS governors could keep motor vehicles driving the speed limits, not signs. Throwing violators in jail might be “justice”, but that doesn’t bring back the kid who was mowed down.
I also, despite having been smoked my scooter riders, don’t NEED the sidewalks to be forbidden. If a scooter rider CHOOSES to use the sidewalk, I’m fine with that, AS LONG as they operate the scooter in a way appropriate for the context, and that does mean at a lower speed than on the road or bike lane. You’re right, that if we just plain forbid their operation on the sidewalks then my concerns about pedestrians evaporate entirely, but I still think that’s heavy handed.
Anyways, if there exists technology for a Tesla can more or less drive itself, I’m sure a scooter can know if it’s on a sidewalk. In your world, it could maybe stop and force the rider to dismount because they’re prohibited from that space, but I’m fine with it just being like “since you’re on the sidewalk we’re speed limiting you to 8mph”
I think you’re right. I just hate it when bandaid solutions for failures of infrastructure are left as “good enough” when they should be treated as a way to buy time while long-term solutions like divided bike lanes, narrower roads with more speed tables, and public transit upgrades. The actual solutions are ignored when the bandaid solutions aren’t themselves criticized, and without actual investment in public infrastructure we’re never going to make our walkways actually totally safe.
Does participation in good faith mean only agreement with you? One is an unregulated vehicle capable of hugh speed, the other two require specific licensing, and are already regulated by countless rules.
ah yes, time to build scooter lanes in pedestrian districts that pedestrians aren’t allowed on and make it a crime to cross them when there’s traffic. great idea.
Whew! It’s a good thing trucks never go through cross walks or across curb cuts to get into parking lots and drive throughs.
The only reason people ride scooters on the sidewalks is because our infrastructure is severely lacking and you get stuck “sharing” a lane with a 6000+lb truck.
but you don’t even need to be particularly swole to reach 30 km/h on a bicycle, how does that work then? Do they arrest people without speedometers on their bikes?
I’ve been hit by people on Escooters 3 times in the last 4 years.
If you wanna add speed controls to cars fine, but I think the ones that cohabit the sidewalk that people are routinely driving drunk as fuck can absolutely stay speed locked.
I never said they were mutually exclusive. I’m just saying everyone is sharing some bad experience with scooters but the other side of the coin has been silenced.
Though I will say that I live in a city with plenty of scooter use and I can’t think of a time it’s been a major issue. Meanwhile cars and trucks threaten my life on a daily basis.
The other side of this conversation has been “silenced”?
This is literally the fuckcars community.
There aren’t two “sides”. That’s my point. Considering them as opposing positions is what demonstrates that you and others are considering them as somehow related, somehow in conflict. It’s you seeing an argument where none need exist.
You don’t have to un-govern scooters to govern cars.
You can say “I think we should limit the velocity of any vehicle that operates in proximity to pedestrians to a degree to keep them safe”.
That’s what I want. Where is the argument? Are we on different “sides”??
They’re implying that people who got hit by one of the other two vehicles in the image are not alive anymore to comment about getting hit by it, hence they got silenced.
Right? The scooters are only in the sidewalks because the cars actively make the roads dangerous for them. But here we are in a place that supposedly hates cars defending them against a very useful replacement for a huge amount of people.
My city has a pretty good protected bike lane network, and a result is you rarely see scooters or bikes on the sidewalks (at least in the parts of town with good protected bike lanes). Instead, you get lots of scooters and bikes zipping safely by without endangering pedestrians. At least on my route to work, I’m about 90% sure there are more commuters in the bike lanes than cars on the road, despite the cars getting 90+% of the road space.
I frickin love protected bike lanes. Turns a stressful experience into a downright pleasant one. It feels 10000x safer than riding on streets without protection.
You should still wear a helmet. It isn’t there for cars, it’s there because going from biking speed to no speed is more than enough acceleration to cause injury.
it’s so fascinating how people absolutely lose their minds over e-scooters, and these are people who shit on drivers for doing the exact same thing to cyclists!
Yeah I hate these scooters even with good infrastructure (Germany) people still can’t stop themselves from basically trying to run you over and when they are not in use they are usually left in a place (sidewalks, pedestrian paths etc) that blocks pedestrian traffic. Not to mention the people taking shitload of this stuff into the public transport and making it even more crowded.
Never had a driving license, can’t be bothered with it when public transport gets the job done.
But like people don’t ride them badly here, so clearly that’s a solvable problem. I’d wager germany generally doesn’t actually really have that good bicycle infrastructure.
As for them being left all over the place, that’s a regulation problem specific to rental scooters, and doesn’t apply at all to privately owned ones but people like you just ignore that completely.
Also like, you’ve seen where people park their cars, right? a car in the middle of the bike path is vastly more annoying than an e-scooter.
Calling problems “solvable problems” or “regulation problems” does not make them go away they are still problems associated with e-scooters. I always hear good stuff about Germany’s bicycle infrastructure but I guess it is suddenly bad when it is covenient for you to make your point.
Of course a car parked on a bike path is more annoying than e-scooters I’ve never said e-scooters were worse than cars, but still I find them extremely annoying as a person that is travelling mostly on foot.
They need the same infrastructure that bicycles and have gotten popular really fast. Since the infrastructure cannot accomodate them (no bike lane), the scotters become a nuisance for everyone.
With proper infrastructure though (cycling lanes and parking spots) they are fine. (Some might argue about users not following the rules, I’d say, sometimes you can’t respect the rules because the street is shit).
Also private companies monopolising public space, not cool. (that one I still stand by, and I hope they pay “rent” that goes towards maintaining the roads.)
I suspect there is a bit of a compounding effect with renting the scooters (more prevalent where I live), which makes users less respectful. Or a novelty effect with teenagers rushing past on their new toy. In my experience that wears out fast, though.
I guess even here some forget that you can put the scooters on bike lanes :)
Same here, my town simply has multi-use paths basically on every other street and the only problem i see with e-scooters is that for some inscrutable reason people insist on parking the rental ones literally in the middle of the road???
It’s incredibly strange because they don’t even park them near a destination, literally just in the middle of nowhere…
But other than that people behave really well, and it makes me smile so very much to see families where the kids have their own bikes and e-scooters and the parents are riding rental ones, the added convenience of e-scooters has absolutely gotten more people out of their cars and actually experiencing the world and interacting with people around them.
That and the assholes who just dump them in the middle of what little infrastructure we do have. Around here they are constantly blocking sidewalk, bike lanes, and mixed use paths.
All city needs to do is to put giant “put ebikes here” sign over on-street vehicle storage spot(in car-dependent places it’s called parking spot). One such spot can store 10-20 ebikes or 20-30 escooters.
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