How is it even possible/practical to obey traffic laws?

I’m talking specifically about obeying the speed limit, doing a full stop at stop signs, etc. After receiving a speeding ticket for doing 53 in a 50, As an experiment I went a full day obeying all traffic laws 100% and it caused so much road rage. For example, there is a 2 lane road near me with a speed limit of 50 (where I got the ticket), traffic usually moves at about 60/65. There was a huge line of cars behind me and nowhere to pull over. As soon as an opening came up on the shoulder I was about to pull over and one of the cars behind me blew past me on the on the right blaring their horn. Then another truck passed me at the next opportunity and brake checked me. Both of these cars proceeded to run a red light about 1/4 mile ahead of me endangering others. By far the worst part of driving on this 2 lane road was the 25 mph work zone which is completely ignored by everyone else. It effectively resulted in me doing 25 mph in a “60” which is very dangerous.

Having needed to spend the entire day pulling over at every opportunity to let people pass I inevitably picked up a drill bit and got a flat tire.

Even matters as simple as stopping completely at a stop sign for 1 second cause immediate anger and dangerous behavior from other drivers.

What on earth are we expected to do? All I want is to avoid speeding tickets and drive safely.

argv_minus_one,

What on earth are we expected to do?

Pay the fines. It’s a money-making scheme, not a public-safety scheme.

chahk,

Exactly. It’s also a “jerks on power trips” scheme for the police. A ticket for going 53 in a 50 zone will be dismissed by any judge, but the cops know you probably don’t have the time to waste taking them to court over $100.

I’m terms of other impatient drivers, that’s why you have a middle finger on each hand.

CmdrShepard,

Not to mention it’s easy work for them. Why solve a murder when you can just bust some people for driving at the same speed as traffic? Solving murders doesn’t generate any money for the department or state.

IuseArchbtw,
@IuseArchbtw@feddit.de avatar

In Germany, it’s against the law to not do a full stop at traffic signs. You will fail your driving test doing this and you’ll definitely get pulled over when you’re seen doing it.

Ocelot,

It is very much against the law in the US too. The point is that any attempt to follow the law causes serious safety issues around road rage.

moonsnotreal,
@moonsnotreal@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

American cops are a bit more lenient, but you will get penalized for it on the driving test.

cymor,

It depends on the jurisdiction. Small towns will absolutely ticket you for a lack of a full stop.

socsa,

Op is full of shit. I’ve stopped at every stop sign the entire time I’ve been driving and there’s never been any issue. This is a troll. Plain and simple.

8ace40,

In Argentina it’s against the law too. I have never seen anyone, ever, stop at a stop sign. At most people slow down a little more than usual. Not even cops stop at stop signs. But if you don’t stop in your driver test, they can theoretically deny your license. So this is definitely a regional thing.

Fwiw, I visited a lot of South American countries, and Argentina is one of the most respectful of traffic laws. But yeah, stop signs are merely a suggestion at best. People slow down way more in a “dangerous crossing” sign, than a stop sign.

driving_crooner,
@driving_crooner@lemmy.eco.br avatar

Not even cops stop at stop signs.

You’re talking like if cops respect the laws they’re supposed to enforce.

Linnce,

In Brazil too, but we don’t ever get pulled over for that, so nobody really stops, just slows down and if they see someone coming they stop. I’ve seen cops running red lights just because there was no one crossing.

andthenthreemore,

Same in the UK. But here most signs are ‘give way’ so there can be confusion when there’s an actual stop sign.

lotanis,

I think the UK has completely eliminated the US style stop sign. I haven’t seen one in years.

andthenthreemore,

Well that sent me down a random Wikipedia dive.

In the United Kingdom, stop signs may only be placed at junctions with tramways or sites with severely restricted visibility.[30] Until 2016, each stop sign had to be individually approved by the Secretary of State for Transport.[31][32] This requirement was removed by the 2016 amendments to the Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions;[33][34] the responsibility for approving stop signs now lies with local authorities

I remember Tom Scott did a video about a really dangerous junction with one a few years ago. The road layout there has now been fixed so it’s not needed.

I’ve never seen one in the wild though.

notexecutive,

I think you can take that 53 mph to court. Thats way too close to be legit.

baked_tea,

reddit post about possibly uncalibrated speed meters

CaptFeather,

Yeah wtf, cops in socal don’t typically even bother unless you’re doing 15 over. Must have been desperate to hit their ticket quota

TWeaK,

In most jurisdictions police can do you for even 1mph over. There are a number of things in their favour, as they’ll have multiple pieces of evidence (device readout + police statement minimum) against only you and your word. Some places will also give you a far worse outcome if you lose in court than if you just accept the ticket. At the very least you should talk to a lawyer first about how best to take it to court and the likelihood of winning.

End of the day, with the way car speedo’s over-read, for you to be doing 53 mph your needle would’ve been reading ~56, which is well over.

tikitaki,
@tikitaki@kbin.social avatar

I've been driving for about a decade and a half now, including a few years here and there working jobs with a lot of wheel time. Either pizza delivery or cable technician or driving around a box truck.

I have never gotten as much as a speeding ticket. I typically don't speed more than 5~10 mph over the limit. If it's a 35 or 40 in a city area though I will typically stay the speed limit. Sometimes I go a little ham on country roads in the middle of nowhere. I drove through central Florida once at like 4am and I peaked at like 120mph because I hadn't seen another car for at least an hour.

I think it probably depends on your jurisdiction, but nobody really respects the laws. On the interstate near my house, the speed limit is 65 but it might as well be 80. Cops will pass you and people will pass the cops and nobody cares.

I think the speeding laws are just to give the cops a reason to pull you over if they want you - OR a way to get people that are really being crazy. For example if you're going 110 in a 65 you deserve to get pulled over and given a ticket or worse, depending on context.

some_guy,

I think it probably depends on your jurisdiction

This is the real answer. There’s a town near me that used to be training grounds for new sheriff’s deputies. The accepted rule was to never deviate by even 1mph there. I recently heard that training doesn’t happen there anymore, but I’m not willing to risk it unless I’m in the middle of a bunch of other cars that are also going above the limit so I don’t stand out.

djmarcone,

You should protest the ticket in court. Going along with traffic is a valid defense. Get documentation of the behavior mentioned in your post. Doing what you did is more dangerous than going 3 over. The local bureaucracy has a problem there and you can use this issue to shine light on it.

FlaminGoku,

It’s not a valid defense. I tried using it once and the judge said, if they all drove off a bridge, would you too?

You will have better luck arguing the 3 mph is within the margin of error of the radar gun, that you were on a hill that was slightly accelerating, you slightly sped up to avoid and accident, etc.

kent_eh,

Or within the margin of error of your speedometer.

MomoTimeToDie,

deleted_by_author

    •
    FlaminGoku,

    First speeding ticket in my late teens so live and learn.

    ch00f,

    Realize that a lot of traffic laws are more or less designed to make everyone a criminal. That leaves it up to the cop to decide who they like to pull over.

    Sprinkle in a little racism and bam! This is America.

    cooopsspace,

    Write to your local member.

    Care less about what others do.

    Move to a first world nation or state. (Most of the US isn’t).

    Definitely get a dashcam.

    Post dashcam footage on YouTube.

    Send a bill to the city to the tyre.

    Complain about people’s dangerous road behaviour until the behaviour is enforced or speed changed.

    Ocelot,

    You know after thinking about it, its only really been a huge problem on this one road where I live. The speed limit varies between 35,45,50 mph and theres one construction zone that is 25 mph. As a whole traffic goes about 60-70mph throughout. Its a windy valley road that is frequented by bicycles and hikers and people have absolutely been killed there in speed related accidents. I sent a message to the sheriff’s department voicing concerns but I’ve heard complaints from neighbors about it for years and its still a huge problem.

    On other roads especially highways its mostly no problem to avoid speeding as long as you stay in the right lane, after all trucks avoid speeding most of the time for efficiency and safety reasons, unless you hit a 50-55mph zone like for construction. Those are nearly always ignored by other drivers. Slowing down to comply with the speed limit is likely to get you rear ended since so many are distracted. If you’re lucky enough not to be rear ended it usually results in getting flipped off, but sometimes road rage incidents can escalate.

    CurlyMoustache,
    @CurlyMoustache@lemmy.world avatar

    European here. You Americans sure do love stop signs! And I did a full stop. Every time. People honked and looked at me like I was a criminal weird 😢

    PsychedSy,

    Four way stops are even more exciting.

    driving_crooner,
    @driving_crooner@lemmy.eco.br avatar

    NotJustBikes have a video about the only stop sign on the Nederlands.

    krayj,

    I have never been honked at for stopping at a posted stop sign. Maybe that’s how they do it in some other regions of the US, but that’s not how it works in the Pacific Northwest. Are you certain you weren’t honked at for doing something else and just mis-associated it with stopping at a stop sign? Was it a 4 way stop and you didn’t go when it was appropriately your time to go?

    CurlyMoustache,
    @CurlyMoustache@lemmy.world avatar

    It was in LA. No one did a full stop at stop signs. Even saw police cars drive right through. Why not make one road a priority, and then have yield signs on the others? Makes more sense

    cyclohexane,

    You should obey the basic rules such as speed limits, stopping for red light, etc. Driving faster is associated with higher rate of road fatalities.

    The real solution is that our society must abolish the reliance on cars. We should opt for safer modes of transportation that do not make it necessary for us to trust every random person to have the patience and skill for operating a car that can kill people so easily.

    dragoness,

    The Fuck Cars community is so prevalent over here on Lemmy it’s crazy. I wonder why that is.

    Btw you guys do you, no hate or whatever I just see this sentiment everywhere on other people’s posts.

    cyclohexane,

    I think it makes sense. Just think about what makes the average Reddit user interested in a platform like lemmy, and ask yourself if it makes sense that it correlates with fuck cars. I think it makes sense.

    kratoz29,

    Have you tried following traffic laws in GTA games? That is insane indeed.

    Mugmoor,
    @Mugmoor@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

    So you don’t need to obey the laws because others don’t? You’re being childish, it isn’t that big of a deal.

    I will say that ticket you got is bullshit though. That’s just a dick cop.

    EponymousBosh,
    @EponymousBosh@beehaw.org avatar

    I don’t think “not wanting to be the target of others’ road rage for actually following traffic laws” is childish, tbh

    HellAwaits,

    It is when you’re constantly getting harassed on the road for just going even 5 above the speed limit.

    Tb0n3,

    Should absolutely dispute that. It will most likely get thrown out.

    bigschnitz,

    It’s incorrect to think of most road laws as being in place for safety, instead recognize that it’s largely a tax by another name. It is never safe to drive 20mph below prevailing traffic, regardless of what the sign on the side of the road instructs.

    To avoid fines, pay attention and try to avoid routes where there are often cops collecting a toll, especially during quieter times when you’re one of a smaller number of commuters (and more likely to be the sucker who gets pinged). If you’re white, congratulations, you’re way less likely to be the unlucky party who gets pinged.

    lukecooperatus,

    One time when I lived in Utah, I literally got pulled over for driving the speed limit. Literally. The cop told me that I needed to go with the flow of traffic instead. He didn’t give me a ticket, but it was still an annoying interruption to my day, and I assume it gave him a power boner of some sort.

    But another time, living in the same area, I got pulled over by a different cop for going with the flow of traffic, because speeding isn’t justified even when everyone else on the road is.

    As another comment said, you’re fucked if you do and fucked if you don’t. Although, I do prefer the alternative of going with the flow of traffic to avoid road rage incidents as you’ve pointed out.

    Ocelot,

    I think I would have demanded a ticket in your case. I would have really liked to see how that played out in court.

    Umbrias,

    You’d probably be more likely to get a ticket for a broken tail light or going 51 in a 50 than any sort of court catharsis

    argv_minus_one,

    You realize these guys are allowed to kill you at will, right?

    Tb0n3,

    That’s when you ask for a name and badge number and report them. They’re not allowed to pull you over for nothing.

    ironhydroxide,

    But they are allowed to lie to you, and allowed to pull you over for perceived infractions. So, yes they can pull you over for “nothing”.

    Coreidan,

    It’s damned if you do and damned if you don’t. Welcome to the real world.

    bermuda,

    When I was in drivers’ ed they told us that even if the speed limit is, say, 35 mph, it’s safer to go 45 mph if everybody around you is also going 45 mph. I think most cops are also aware of this, so I wonder if you were just picked on to fulfill a ticket quota or something. Also differences that small in mph are very questionable for a ticket because speedometers can vary wildly and most if not all speedometers have a very minor margin of error. For example you could have been radar tracked at 53 but your speedometer could have been closer to 51 or 50

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