How do you feel about financing a genocide?

I didn’t want to direct this question to Americans specifically because, at this point, other countries have shown support to Israel in one or the other way. If my country was financing this, I would be taking the streets. Shit, I’m right now in the hospital but all I can think about is protesting anyway just to feel I did something to stop this madness.

Are you doing something about this? Are you feeling unsettled? How do you feel about all this mess?

EDIT: So, buying Chinese stuff takes the USS Gerald Ford to Gaza’s coast. Also, TIL that that chocolate my cousin gave me when she was 20 and I was 5, (delicious stuff!) made me a slavist-ish. The fact remains, this genocide is being paid and supported by taxpayers money; of course, I was hoping that most of us didn’t pay taxes wishing for this. Thank you all for your responses, some of them were hard to swallow.

CanadaPlus,

I’m not sure if it constitutes genocide yet, but it’s fair to say it’s going that direction. For every dead group A, group B wants to kill 10 group A people, and vice-versa. There’s two ways that can stop; either they bury the hatchet or one group is entirely wiped out.

As for how I feel about my government, actually kind of hopeful. I was expecting SNAFU but it’s clear the Canadian government is actually having to consider the Palestinian perspective this time around.

state_electrician,

I feel that taking one side over the other without allowing for any nuance in that complicated clusterfuck over there is disingenuous. I feel very sorry for all civilians caught between the many murderous assholes in that region, but I can’t fully support one group while completely condemning the other. Acting like it’s a black and white issue is so very wrong and not helpful.

neptune,

But our government did pick a side. So what is our obligation, then?

java,

Sometimes I feel like people forget that Israel was actually attacked.

serratur,

Still doesn’t justify commiting a genocide

Rivalarrival,

All the evidence so far tells me that nobody is serious about stopping the violence. The only way the violence will end in this region is if the entire region is turned into a sheet of glass.

My only interest in the region is ensuring that the violence continues, until such time as an option other than “glass them all” presents itself.

intensely_human,

Why is that your interest in the region?

jmcs,

Since you probably buy stuff made in China like everyone else, you tell us.

selokichtli,

If you read the thread, or at least my responses, you would probably made a more conscious effort to answer my question.

Sarmyth,

The point is that you’ve made an insulting and reductive statement that borders on propaganda in its presentation. Obviously, no one would be pro genocide but that’s not a side that actually is available to participate actively with either.

This question accomplishes nothing but lets people virtue signal to each other. Feel better now?

selokichtli,

How did you feel insulted? I’m not saying any citizen is guilty of anything. I do not think so. But this is happening with their money. All I’m saying is representatives of these countries should know and follow whatever the people they govern thinks they should do. If you feel insulted, maybe, just maybe that’s on you.

BeamBrain,
@BeamBrain@hexbear.net avatar

What does China have to do with anything?

CloutAtlas,

“it’s not whataboutism when I do it”

yogthos,
@yogthos@lemmy.ml avatar

I just love all these creative ways people find to say that they’re imbeciles without saying it explicitly.

masquenox,

It’s never just been the US - Israel doesn’t just have a whole bunch of enablers… said enablers also back the very idea of a modern-day Israel.

France, the UK, Germany, Australia, Apartheid-era South Africa all played their part in helping with all this - I guess the fact that it’s all countries with histories that are deeply entwined with white supremacism, antisemitism and colonialism is purely coincidence, eh?

ChaddingtonDuck,

Did I read this correctly? You just tried to say that Israel’s supporters are antisemitic? How’d you connect those two dots?

masquenox,

You just tried to say that Israel’s supporters are antisemitic?

No. I never tried to say it.

I just plain said it - the countries that enable Israel is as antisemitic and white supremacist as they have always been. They’ve been hiding it since WW2 - but, as the resurgence of mask-off far-right ideology in the US and Europe proves, it’s still the same old west.

The west’s support for Israel has always been antisemitic - dumping European Jewish people in Palestine was literally one the Nazi’s potential solutions to the “Jewish Question”. It’s no secret - just mundane history that westerners doesn’t like talking about.

Christian Zionism predates Jewish Zionism - the whole reason these white supremacist and antisemitic societies fantasized about a modern-day “Israel” was simply because they did not believe Jewish people belonged in their precious “white” societies.

You don’t have to think about it for very long to see it for yourself - who were the people that made it so difficult for Jewish people to “belong” in western societies? If the US was so friendly and welcoming to Jewish people as the US wants to pretend it is (prominent Jewish people like Steven Spielberg and Noam Chomsky will happily tell you about US-style antisemitism), why would Jewish people need a “homeland” in the middle-east?

HappyMeatbag,
@HappyMeatbag@beehaw.org avatar

No. I never tried to say it. I just plain said it…

I’d like to point out to folks that whatever your stance on the issue may be, this statement (taken by itself) is pretty funny.

Please excuse the interruption and continue.

SecretPancake,

Germany is bound to support them no matter what. I understand why but there should be some conditions. It’s a sensitive subject here.

Beyond that I don’t really understand this conflict enough to have an objective opinion.

TheFriendlyDickhead,

I fell like most people have very little idea whats going on. The conflict is extremely complicated.

SkepticElliptic,

Israel is retaliating against civilians for an attack carried out by Hamas. This is what America did in Afghanistan after the attack on the world trade center in 2001. It was dumb and it’s dumb now.

intensely_human,

I’d call it “retaliating” against civilians. Actual retaliation would mean hitting the set of people who attacked Israel.

IMO a big source of the problem is that we’re conflating four groups for two groups.

Government A, People A, Government B, People B.

Any time Government A attacks People B, Government B “retaliates” against People A, and vice versa. It’s not actual retaliation it’s forwarding the violence to someone new.

There are tenuous connections between these governments and these peoples, but it’s not like slapping the guy who just slapped you. It’s like slapping his kid.

demesisx,
@demesisx@infosec.pub avatar

In the US, speaking the truth about the Israel-Palestine ::cough::Palestinian genocide::cough:: war will get you cancelled by AIPAC astroturfers and useful idiots who just cancel who they’re told to cancel. That’s how they (the AIPAC, the military industrial complex, and AIPAC-run film industry…if you don’t believe me, why was Harvey Weinstein so friendly with ex-Mossad agents that he was able to use them against his opponents?) manufacture consent among normal people these days.

Additionally, 35 US states have anti-bds laws on the books punishing US citizens that choose not to buy products from Israel. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-BDS_lawsIn many of those US states you can be fired from government jobs for refusing to buy Israeli products in your own personal life.

SaniFlush,

My country burns money, resources and human lives to enforce its hegemony on the other side of the planet while I only have health insurance through my crappy job and the infrastructure is crumbling everywhere. How do you think I feel?

demystify,

The only thing I’m dissatisfied with is their free hand with bombing civilians along with military targets. I can understand that Israel is angry, and rightfully so, but they fancy themselves a western country, being better than terrorist Hamas. They can’t let their anger take control. Bombing civilians undermines their legitimatecy, I think they should try and be as surgical as possible, like they did in previous rounds of fighting. Other than that, I fully support their desire to root out Hamas. Though conquering Gaza only has any merit to it if they decide to stay and govern it themselves, otherwise Hamas would just rise up again.

selokichtli,

Are you satisfied about they having a nuclear arsenal after this? It’s not a rhetorical question, I’m actually interested in your thoughts about this.

demystify,

I don’t know, what does it matter? They don’t even acknowledge it, nevermind about using it. The only instance in which they might use their nukes is the Samson Option, which looks like something any country would do.

selokichtli,

It matters because it changes all logics in a war. In this case, I think it matters because you described them as angry, bombing civilians along with military targets. If they don’t differentiate one of the other, the only thing stopping them from nuking the Gaza stripe is probably the inconvenience of being too close.

demystify,

Ah, I see. No, they’re not that stupid. Even if nuking Gaza didn’t affect them because of proximity, they wouldn’t. They rely on American help too much, and struggle as they do with international forces. Nuking Gaza would leave them ostricized and heavily sanctioned, if not invaded.

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